Bottlehead Forum
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: azrockitman on June 08, 2013, 06:01:54 PM
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so, when will we see a tuner? ;D
You could call it the AC/DC ;)
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Not speaking for Dan, PJ, or anyone else higher on the totem poll here, but I think I can answer this one. It's not going to happen, for a variety of reasons.
First of all, it would be a rather complicated and expensive kit. That's not necessarily enough to eliminate it from consideration, but the market would be rather limited as high quality FM broadcast stations are fading at a steady rate. Those that still exist are shifting their broadcasting to digital. Remember when TV switched to digital signal only? That's just around the corner for radio and for very similar reasons (namely, it doesn't matter that its bad for consumers, it's good for corporations). Personally speaking, I was considering investing in a high quality tube unit when I lived in Boston and had numerous stations I enjoyed (WMBR, WHRB, WZBC, WGBH has its moments, WERS if I was desperate, WJIB in the car with the wife). Since moving to the west coast, my old KLH is more than enough to pull in the stations I can when I feel capable of tolerating the terrible decisions program directors make here.
Second: building a tuner requires the ability to align a tuner, which involves equipment most people don't have access to and even the people that do don't necessarily know how to use it. That's a huge burden for tech support right there.
Third: Does the name mean you were thinking AM/FM? Double the circuitry so I can hear that I'm going to hell in high fidelity...
The bottom line is there are a lot of great tuners out there if you've got good signals to listen to. If you need a project, find one that need a recap, then send it off to get aligned and enjoy. Also remember the oldest rule of tuners: a lesser tuner with a great antenna sounds better than a great tuner with a crappy antenna.
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Dynaco delivered assembled and aligned tuner sections in their kits. Alignment takes expensive instruments that most hobbyists don't own. Then it takes some skills and some art to align the tuner. I'm friends with Terry DeWick, he lives 4 miles from my house. He doesn't talk about some of his tricks in tuner alignment.
Here are a few samples of his work:
http://www.mcintoshaudio.com/repairs.htm
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Hopes dashed by reality, facts and logic. Foiled again!
Thanks for the detailed responses. I had no idea about the tuner alignment issue and hadn't quite realized that the analog broadcast days were numbered. Thanks!
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My suggestion would be to look for a used Dynaco FM-3 tuner on eBay. You can find working units at <$100. FM-3 documentation is widely available on the www, as well as detailed alignment instructions, with and without specialized IF generator or sweep equipment. Upgrade kits are also available on www.
Examples:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dynaco-FM-3-Sonic-Upgrade-Kit-From-The-FM3ZONE-/300882289899 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dynaco-FM-3-Sonic-Upgrade-Kit-From-The-FM3ZONE-/300882289899)
http://home.comcast.net/~netminer/FM3ZONE.html (http://home.comcast.net/~netminer/FM3ZONE.html)
I have reworked 3 with very good results. The FM-3 is a wonderful learning platform if you really want to understand how tube stereo FM receivers work.
Today 95% of all tuner applications are SWR 1-chip IC's for automotive/portable + digital & satellite applications - http://www.nxp.com/documents/leaflet/75017318.pdf (http://www.nxp.com/documents/leaflet/75017318.pdf) - but the FM-3 is a heck of a lot more fun .....
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VALVE v6n1 - Buddha's mods for the FM-3. Just sayin' ...
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I was just looking at that. Not the article, Buddha's FM-3. Sitting in the lab at home.
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Tuner is a dirty word in the DIY realm of existence IMO. Separate the tasks. Then you have control. Its all about control. Control freaks. We are. No qualms there. Yank out that mass of wires and resistors and simply it.
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Funny I feel just the opposite. The FM tuner is an exquisite device. They are fascinating to dig into and try to squeeze everything you can out of. Unfortunately I agree with Josh, there just isn't enough worthwhile programming to warrant it. And the SQ of most FM stations these days is not like it was in the days of live analog broadcasts, it's probably just about as good from a station's digital stream.
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I can see how doc would feel that way. But for us mortals, its too much. Steve Guttenburg likes them. I want to be able to point my finger at the culprit causing my dislike and replace it..... Without getting an EE degree.
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I just want to say , I totally agree with Doc's post... The days of the amazing old tuners are coming to a close.. I was inspired to post.. It is 4:37 am and I am very much enjoying Dori Monson on KIRO like I used to, and can switch over and listen to the London talk stations that I used to enjoy also, right here in a totally different continent through the internet.. Absolutely superb...Unprecedented times in radio broadcasting these days...
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I just want to say , I totally agree with Doc's post... The days of the amazing old tuners are coming to a close.. I was inspired to post.. It is 4:37 am and I am very much enjoying Dori Monson on KIRO like I used to, and can switch over and listen to the London talk stations that I used to enjoy also, right here in a totally different continent through the internet.. Absolutely superb...Unprecedented times in radio broadcasting these days...
I was just about to say that with internet radio a tuner is something that really isnt needed anymore.
I do really like the old and even some new tuners. The McIntosh MR88 is a beautiful device. However HD Radio was arguably a huge failure.
Even though internet radio has many issues of it's own it's nice to be able to customize the playing lists with Pandora and Spotify.
I dont even buy digital music anymore thanks to the online radio stations.
Only time I use the radio is when I am going down the road.
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I use my Squeezebox Touch to listen to the radio and find it to be convenient,and the only time I use it is for my girls. They don't appreciate the music Gina and I listen to.
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Of course, little girls wouldn't like Cannibal Corpse or Venom's "Welcome to Hell"... Sure, that is understandable... :) Yeah, I LOVE tuners myself (had a Scott 350B and the ultra rare Pioneer F-26) and WANTED to keep them.. But I just saw the writing on the wall and away they went to other people..Heck, my Pioneer retailed for a $1000 new in the 1970s and in 2008, I sold it for $1350...:) And the guy was super chuffed to get it..Now though, If I was back in the states, I love local talk stations, so, my Pioneer vintage receiver will suffice nicely....No need for my premium tuners anymore...
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I use a Tivoli Model 10 and am quite pleased with the performance.
Two hundred bucks, small & elegant, what's not to like?
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I have 2 Tivoli pals. "Only" $100. One is more than 10 years old, I found a cold solder on the speaker post after may years of use and fixed that. Rebuilt the battery pack many times. Finally it stopped working, and I ordered a new one. After looking at it closely, I found that the speaker was blown. I found a Tang-Band speaker that was a close enough fit on paper. The mounting holes were not a match, so I built a "custom" mounting bracket out of several plies of thin aluminum, and sealed the edges with epoxy putty . Still works great sounds a little different than the new one (less bass and brighter highs).