Bottlehead Forum

Bottlehead Kits => Eros Tape => Topic started by: jcmusic on October 30, 2009, 10:05:06 AM

Title: Eros Discussion
Post by: jcmusic on October 30, 2009, 10:05:06 AM
I am just kinda wondering why there hasn't been any talk here about the new product?

Jay
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on October 30, 2009, 02:18:02 PM
We don't have the kit version ready yet, as I need to finish writing the assembly manual. We have sold a few assembled ones. Perhaps the owners will share their impressions.
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: ckniker on November 03, 2009, 11:02:01 AM
Is the Assembly Manual the only thing holding up sales of the Eros Tape Preamp Kit?

If so, is it possible to order the parts now (without the Manual) and download the Manual when it's ready? I'd like to have the parts on hand and rearing to go.

Thanks in advance,
Chris

p.s. I just bought an Otari MX-5050 B2HD within the last week and I'm anxious to hear the improvements an external repro amp will make.
Title: Eros tape head preamp available to order
Post by: Doc B. on November 16, 2009, 05:08:45 PM
We are finishing up the assembly manual this week and I have put up an order page. There is no descriptive copy yet, just a photo. I should have the copy taken care of in the next day or two. In the meantime, if you want to get into the queue there's a live order button on the page -

http://www.bottlehead.com/store.php?crn=220&rn=440&action=show_detail (http://www.bottlehead.com/store.php?crn=220&rn=440&action=show_detail)

(http://www.bottlehead.com/sc_images/products/440_image.jpg)
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on November 24, 2009, 08:47:29 AM
I have fallen a bit behind on the manual, but it is in the process of getting put together. Should be done not too long after the Thanksgiving weekend.
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on December 01, 2009, 10:45:01 AM
OK, I just completed the manual! Yeeehaaw! That makes four assembly manuals I have written this year which is, I think, a record. We had one or two resistors that are shared with the Eros phono version, that ran out while we were getting this done. Those will be here in the next day or two and we will be ready to begin shipping.
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: ckniker on December 01, 2009, 11:12:11 AM
On a (somewhat) related topic, how different is the RIAA eq curve from the NAB (or IEC curve) ?

Here's the gist of my question:

Because I don't have an Eros yet (it's been ordered), I've been playing my rewired Otari Mx5050 head outputs through my existing phono stage (MM input) for the last week or so. As one would imagine, the music has been less than stellar.

Is the RIAA curve different enough (from NAB) that I should expect a major improvement when I eventually hook up to an Eros?

Clearly, I understand that there may be many factors in why I'm getting poor sound currently. I'm using 7 1/2 commercially recorded tapes (bought off ebay). My MX5050 has been cleaned but not yet modded (for tape path improvements).

Thanks in advance,
Chris
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on December 01, 2009, 12:07:06 PM
Check out p.166 at the link below:


http://books.google.com/books?id=GnETXiwh94UC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&dq=riaa+vs+nab+equalization&source=bl&ots=MHk37lwyE3&sig=JU8TE_078JC-r4W6OOoyYVtXlM0&hl=en&ei=4Z8VS9ixC4PasQOYndiMBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CAsQ6AEwATgy#v=onepage&q=&f=false (http://books.google.com/books?id=GnETXiwh94UC&pg=PA165&lpg=PA165&dq=riaa+vs+nab+equalization&source=bl&ots=MHk37lwyE3&sig=JU8TE_078JC-r4W6OOoyYVtXlM0&hl=en&ei=4Z8VS9ixC4PasQOYndiMBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CAsQ6AEwATgy#v=onepage&q=&f=false)
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Paul Joppa on December 01, 2009, 12:54:18 PM
Here's a plot, which also shows the very low frequency rolloffs for our implementations of the IEC (which calls for infinite gain at DC, not physically realizable).
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: ckniker on December 01, 2009, 12:56:48 PM
That helps to answer my question.

I'm surprised to read that the NAB eq curve has a tape speed (IPS) dependency in it!

Given that I don't see a speed EQ switch on the Eros (aside from NAB/IEC), should I assume that the EQ is optimized to one speed (15 IPS?)?  Or is it a compromise ?

Thanks,
Chris
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Norbert A. on January 09, 2010, 10:43:20 AM
I am very interested in buying an Eros tape head preamplifier. But looking at the curves and the dependency of tape speed I have no idea what will happen when playing a prerecorded tape at 3 3/4 ips (there are some in my collection).
Is 3 3/4 ips similar to 7 1/2 or 15 ips?
Norbert
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Paul Joppa on January 09, 2010, 02:02:51 PM
The Eros is set up to play IEC and CCIR tapes at 15ips, and NAB tapes at 7.5 or 15ips (the equalization is the same for NAB at 7.5 and 15ips). It does not (in stock form) support 3.75 in either NAB or IEC. Other standards not supported in stock form are AES or IEC at 30ips, MRL, or Nagra Master at 15ips.

It has a 2-position switch, so you can get any two of those options - it would be easy to make a setup for NAB at 3.75 and 7.5 or 15ips, with no IEC support, for example. If you are an advanced amateur you might be able to fit a different (very small!) rotary switch with more positions.

We chose these because most available commercial tapes are 7.5ips NAB, and we needed to support the Tape Project tapes at 15ips IEC. For a full suite of equalizations I would probably use a different layout, leaving room for a shielded switch box to contain the equalization options. The same applies to non-RIAA phono equalizations, which some with archives of early recordings might wish for.
Title: A few more Eros question
Post by: johnsonad on April 27, 2010, 07:39:33 AM
Hello again Doc and Paul,

Have a couple more questions in regards to the Eros Tape.

1.  I'm using an Otari with standard 2 and 4 track heads direct output.  Does the Eros have enough gain by itself or should I mate it with a head amp or step-up trannies?

2.  If it has plenty of gain in your experience with the Otari, can it be set up from the factory with proper input impedance to match the direct out and stock playback heads?

Thank you in advance.

Aaron
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on April 27, 2010, 08:25:35 AM
The Eros tape head preamp has enough gain for the MX 5050 at 50dB, and the stock input impedance is fine. For what it's worth we've had lousy luck trying to get a step up transformer to work with a tape head.
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: johnsonad on April 27, 2010, 08:50:18 AM
Wow Doc, that was fast and just what I wanted to hear.  For some reason I was under the impression that you needed to measure and match the output impedance of the playback heads, thanks for clearing that up. 
Title: Re: Eros Discussion
Post by: Doc B. on April 27, 2010, 09:50:02 AM
The input impedance can have some effect on the high end response due to head damping on some types of heads. The Otari playback heads are pretty happy with the stock setup.