Bottlehead Forum
Bottlehead Kits => Crack => Topic started by: rat3hat on June 21, 2020, 12:16:36 AM
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Hi
I have just "completed" my 1st crack build. Not there yet it seems! It initially passed all the tests on the "resistance tests" page 47 of the current manual.
When doing the voltage check, there was a small pop sound/ electrical crackle and a touch of smoke, I believe from one of the 100uF, 160V caps on the side of the chassis closet to the headphone jack. This happened somewhere testing the tabs on the bar near the A socket. There are tiny flecks of brownish oil on the chassis, but I can't see a fault in the capacitor or anywhere else. I turned off/ removed the power, tubes, etc.
I have re-checked every step in the manual, checked all the wiring, etc. I have repeated the resistance tests and found that now, at B6 I get no resistance reading. It doesn't make a ton of sense to me (surprise, beginner) and I can't see anything clearly wrong.
I have attached several pictures of the build to see what I have done wrong!
Tx
Chris
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Also, assuming I need to replace those 2 caps at least, and I am in the UK, are these OK to use as replacements?
"100uF 160V Audio Note Standard Electrolytic Capacitor" (these are not expensive and they are available locally). Not sure why I can't post external links, but the name should do.
Tx
Chris
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You'll want the designer, PB, to help troubleshoot this. But in the interim:
There are tiny flecks of brownish oil on the chassis
That's normal and harmless. It's flux from the solder. If you use a high flux solder like Cardas Quad Eutectic, you'll get a lot of those specks. They're actually hard - you can pop them off with a fingernail (but you don't need to - all of my amps have those everywhere).
but I can't see a fault in the capacitor
It hasn't popped, so it might still be fine.
now, at B6 I get no resistance reading.
I don;t think the cap should affect the resistance reading at B6 - so I suspect a wiring/soldering problem. Do you still get a reistance reading of 2.9K at terminal 9? If so, the bad resistance reading at B6 points to a bad connection between B6 and terminal 9. Try reheating the connection of the red wire at 9 and add a tiny bit more solder.
cheers, Derek
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Tx v much Derek.
"Cardas Quad Eutectic" - nailed it. Tx.
A bit more solder on B6 and that point it is reading fine now. All resistance and voltage tests pass now.
I think the B3 point made a bit of an "zzzt" noise when the tube powered on. That said, it passed all the tests and didn't do that again.
I guess I need to power this thing on with headphones... finding sacrificial headphones to try; not keen to plug in my Verite right off the bat!
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Cool.
But just to be extra sure, I'd also reheat and add a touch of solder to the terminal 9 joint with the red wire. It's possible that the bad connection is in fact there and wasn't at B6, and that the slight movement of the red wire when resoldering B6 temporarily brought the red wire back into contact with terminal 9.
cheers, Derek
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Tx very much, again. I have done just that, and touched up a few more points on the other capacitor and B3.
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What resistance do you get at terminal 9?
There isn't anything going on here that would lead me to believe you have a blown capacitor, definitely don't replace it.
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Thanks for coming back. It is reading 2.9K as expected. LEDs on, tubes glow, etc.
The small-pop/small smoke during voltage testing threw me. I've been over the connections and made a few touches to ensure 6,7,9,10, B3, B6 are all good.
I think it is OK. All tests at least are good and there is no more snap/crackle/pop. I'll get my inexpensive DAC from the office this week & use sacrificial (cheap) headphones to give a go ASAP. Even though the tests pass, I am afraid to plug it into expensive headphones/DAC, until I hear it working for a bit.
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You didn't use any additional flux right? (Just the solder on its own)
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Just the solder, no extra flux.
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I have gotten back to the Crack project. All tests pass, but there was still a very audible hum/buzz. After searching the forum, I went back and reflowed all the solder joints in the amp. It still crackled, so I swapped tubes. It still crackles. I am using inexpensive low impedence headphones to see of "it works at all", so I don't plug in expensive headphones and hurt them. I did plug in a pair of high impedence headphones and the noice is VERY loud. Is the advice to reflow the joints again? Not sure what to do next. Pictures of the circuit are above, and happy to post pics of the reflowed joints if that helps.
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Typically background noise would get more quiet rather than louder with higher impedance headphones. The fact that it changed when you plugged in a different set of cans indicates that it could be a bad joint where the black wires connect to the headphone jack. This is a pretty common spot for a cold solder joint that causes noise.
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Thank you. I will check there.
FWIW - the high impedance headphones made a reliably louder hum (swapping back/forth) i.e.; hum w/ low impedance, louder hum with high impedance, Back to low, back to high, same pattern.
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Can you post some updated photos of your amp? Looking over the ones you first posted, I see a lot of joints that never got adequate heat. You need to heat your solder joints until the solder flows into them, and from what I see there are a lot of joints where the solder is just sitting on top of things.
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Thanks again for reviewing my cack-handed work. :-\ Perhaps when reflowing yesterday, I added too much solder at some points... not really sure. My soldering prior to this has been mostly DIY headphone cables and simple tube adapters. Whilst I practiced on simple tab strips also, perhaps I really just mucked up the soldering?? :'(
Here are some more pics.
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You aren't heating the joints enough. Look at 19 and 18 lower terminals. Do you see how there's no solder flowing through the terminal strip? Now hold your iron onto each of those terminals until the solder flows into the terminal strip, then repeat for the whole amp.
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Thank you Paul. On it.
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Thank you, again for your help. I feel like a 3 year old. Humbling!
Another round of re-soldering. My current voltage checks fail for terminals 1 & 7 now.
1 is supposed to be 50-100V, it is reading ~158V
7 is supposed to be 90-115V, it is reading ~155V
What have I done?!
Tx
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Do both halves of your 12AU7 glow?
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It looks like it. Photo attached.
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Can you carefully measure the voltage at A8?
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1.63V
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How about A7?
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Small spark when measuring at A7. A7=0V.
Remeasuring A8, it is now 13.3! I checked it several times, this time, and last time.
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And the LED is not lit?
That LED is toast. You can temporarily place a wire between A3 and A8 to get around this issue.
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Thank you, Paul. I really, really appreciate your help.
That LED did go (i.e.; it no longer glows) and a wire from A3-A8 did get the voltage at A8 back to 1.6. The other voltage measurements in the manual are back to matching the ranges. Earlier in this thread 1 and 7 which were (I think) erroneous are now in range.
A7 = 0, is that correct? I have assumed it is.
The amp turns on and the tubes glow. The other LED glows. When I 1st turned it on, it had more low grade background noise, which didn't change with the volume knob. It produces sound. The amp still has pops and clicks, some loud. I assume this is my apparently abysmal soldering! Would you perhaps advise an overhaul level, desolder/remove some solder, re-solder to sure everything up? Humbling!
Tx
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Pops and clicks could certainly be solder joint issues. One thing we will recommend is to plug an inexpensive pair of headphones into the amp and poke around the circuit with a wooden chopstick to see which joints set off the noises.
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Hi
I have done the chopstick test, and patched that wire past the dead LED. I can't really get it to crackle by touching anything. Today I turned it on, let it warm up for 30 mins or so, then plugged in a DAC and sacrificial headphones. For maybe 5 minutes, sounded noise free. Then, there was a loud crackle/pop. I took the headphones off my head (it was loud). I don't quite understand why, but the music player stopped. Laptop> USB> DAC> RCA> Crack. When I pressed play again, it played OK.
I have a few times been over the soldering and can't really find an issue. Frustrating. I am guessing it is still likely a soldering issue somewhere?
Thanks again for the hand-holding.
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If the music player stopped, it's possible that what's going on may not be in the Crack itself.
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I do think it is very, very odd. The same setup has always worked without issue (same laptop>DAC>[amp]>headphones) with at least 2 other amps. I will go and try it with another amp again now.
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There was a poor solder joint at the bottom left-most (closest to the 9-pin socket) point of the headphone jack. There are 2 black wires connected to it and a repeat of the "pencil test" with a bit more vigour revealed consistent crackling when either black wire was touched.
I have plugged in proper headphones finally.
I'll use it for a bit, then swap some tubes, then put in the Speedball in a few weeks.
Thank you again for your help. It has been humbling and rewarding.
Best,
Chris
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Don't forget to replace the led.
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Thanks for the reminder. I absolutely would have forgotten to do that. I've just ordered a replacement pack from the Bottlehead shop. Is it safe to use the amp normally before this is replaced? If not a safety issue, is there a quality issue?
What electrical function does the LED serve? Does it drop the voltage slightly or something along those lines?
Thanks again.
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Thanks for the reminder. I absolutely would have forgotten to do that. I've just ordered a replacement pack from the Bottlehead shop. Is it safe to use the amp normally before this is replaced? If not a safety issue, is there a quality issue?
What electrical function does the LED serve? Does it drop the voltage slightly or something along those lines?
Thanks again.
Wait until you get your replacement LED's. Their function is to bias the cathode on the 12AU7.
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Thank you.
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The amp is 100% safe and fine to use with one LED if you have the jumper between A3 and A8.