Bottlehead Forum
Bottlehead Kits => Legacy Kit Products => Seduction => Topic started by: rebbi on December 01, 2014, 02:18:18 PM
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Hi,
I was wondering what I might do to max out the potential of my Seduction phono stage. I am still using the original tubes.
Additionally, several years ago, Forum member "mingles" was nice enough to send me a couple of large, Russian capacitors (Teflon?) but I never installed them and I'm not certain where they'd go. They are encased in metal on the outside and seem to have a white, plastic-looking core.
All ideas appreciated.
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Yes, you just described a Russian military surplus Teflon cap. There will be a "0.47" or a "0.1" on the barrel of the Russian cap. That tells you the position where it will go.
If they are 0.1 they go between T26 and T29; the other channel is T36 and T39. If they are 0.47 then they go from terminal T32 and the output RCA jack center conductor; the other channel is T42 and the output RCA jack center conductor. There should be brown caps in all four positions now.
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Yes, you just described a Russian military surplus Teflon cap. There will be a "0.47" or a "0.1" on the barrel of the Russian cap. That tells you the position where it will go.
If they are 0.1 they go between T26 and T29; the other channel is T36 and T39. If they are 0.47 then they go from terminal T32 and the output RCA jack center conductor; the other channel is T42 and the output RCA jack center conductor. There should be brown caps in all four positions now.
Grainger,
Thanks for the speedy reply!
So, why would someone replace the original caps? Are these supposed to sound better?
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I had a 0.1 in my Seduction. The Teflon caps sound smoother. The high end is more detailed and open sounding. Check this 0.1uF Teflon cap:
http://www.partsconnexion.com/product6327.html
They are only $61 each when bought in pairs.
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I had a 0.1 in my Seduction. The Teflon caps sound smoother. The high end is more detailed and open sounding. Check this 0.1uF Teflon cap:
http://www.partsconnexion.com/product6327.html
They are only $61 each when bought in pairs.
Sounds worth trying, then. And what about the tubes themselves. Worth upgrading?
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Oh, yes! ! After a number of years tubes wear out. I changed two pair in my system last week.
Here is a thread that gives all tube substitutes for the Seduction:
http://bottlehead.com/smf/index.php?topic=1029.msg7557#msg7557
I use the second one in the list. Again, Russian military surplus, 6N23P. Many are on ebay and relatively cheap.
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Oh, yes! ! After a number of years tubes wear out. I changed two pair in my system last week.
Here is a thread that gives all tube substitutes for the Seduction:
http://bottlehead.com/smf/index.php?topic=1029.msg7557#msg7557
I use the second one in the list. Again, Russian military surplus, 6N23P. Many are on ebay and relatively cheap.
Very cool. I just looked on eBay and there seem to be lots of people in Russia and the Ukraine eager to sell these tubes. A lot of them are described as "Vokhsod." And they are pretty cheap. Thank you for all the information!!
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Do get the '"EV" version. The date code on them is two numbers, month and year of manufacture. Try either 60s or 70s if you can get them. I have sent a message to a number of sellers and they are eager to help you get the decade tubes you want.
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Do get the '"EV" version. The date code on them is two numbers, month and year of manufacture. Try either 60s or 70s if you can get them. I have sent a message to a number of sellers and they are eager to help you get the decade tubes you want.
Oh, one other question!
It seems as if the leads on those Russian capacitors have oxidized somewhat. Any tips for cleaning them in preparation for installation? I haven't yet had the opportunity to look at the values on them to see where they would go in the Seduction, but your instructions are very clear and I'm sure I will have no trouble figuring out where they go.
Thanks for all your help! I was sorely tempted during the recent Black Friday/Cyber Monday sales to buy the Eros, but even with the 15% discount it's not in my budget right now. :-(
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The leads are slivered. Silver tarnish is as conductive as cleaned silver. I have never cleaned them before soldering.
On the values, there is a "MKΦ", which is microfarads, after the number you are looking for. Also, the voltage is designated by "B" as there is no "V" in their alphabet.
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If you buff the leads with some fine steel wool they will be easier to solder.
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If you buff the leads with some fine steel wool they will be easier to solder.
Great suggestion, Doc, thanks!!
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The leads are slivered. Silver tarnish is as conductive as cleaned silver. I have never cleaned them before soldering.
On the values, there is a "MKΦ", which is microfarads, after the number you are looking for. Also, the voltage is designated by "B" as there is no "V" in their alphabet.
Hey Grainger,
I finally had a chance to take a good look at those Russian, Teflon capacitors. They are of the 0.1 µF variety. I'm a little bummed about that because it's on a more crowded part of the board and is going to be a more challenging replacement – there's a lot of stuff to unsolder, but I'm going to try it anyway. Thanks for all your help!
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Be really careful with those Russian caps. The bodies are conductive, so if they move around and start touching things, well, you know the rest...
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Be really careful with those Russian caps. The bodies are conductive, so if they move around and start touching things, well, you know the rest...
Can you wrap tape around them to insulate them?
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That should work, or wrap them with some some heatshrink..
(https://forum.bottlehead.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fbottlehead.com%2Fsmf%2Findex.php%3Faction%3Ddlattach%3Btopic%3D5316.0%3Battach%3D5107%3Bimage&hash=febe42efcb79ca85cdfb3a425911f223a2a75ebe)
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I have found heat shrink tubing to cover every KK Teflon I have from 0.1uF@200V to 0.47uF@630V. That last one took a while to find.
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Yup, or a big piece of heatshrink.
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I have found heat shrink tubing to cover every KK Teflon I have from 0.1uF@200V to 0.47uF@630V. That last one took a while to find.
Ah, okay, that's great, and thanks for the photo. I see you have a plastic tie around the cap, presumably to stabilize it physically? How did you do that?
Those caps as you know are enormous... what kind of wire did you use? I'm thinking again of something stiff to help hold it in place...
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The tie wrap is looped around the tube socket board to take the weight so the solder joints aren't supporting it all. Wire is just a piece of thick solid core, thick enough to be rigid so nothing flops around in there.
If the chassis plate is cool enough you could stick some of these on to mount the tie wraps.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=adhesive+tie+wrap+holder&_from=R40&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xadhesive+tie+wrap+base&_nkw=adhesive+tie+wrap+base&_sacat=0 (http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_odkw=adhesive+tie+wrap+holder&_from=R40&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xadhesive+tie+wrap+base&_nkw=adhesive+tie+wrap+base&_sacat=0)
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I don't like big caps hanging by their leads. Especially the big, heavy metal cased Russian caps. (and I use a ton of the Russkies!) I use small rectangles of acrylic sheet screwed to nylon stand-offs on the socket or strip screws. Simple. Dirt cheap! This provides a solid mounting surface, (zip tie down), elevates the caps above the circuitry to make troubleshooting far easier. My experience was that every time I had to move the caps "out of the way", ( or just simply lifting the plate to take a look!), I was running the risk of creating more issues with solder junctions, lead integrity and potential shorting.
I started doing this when I added the C4S upgrade to my Foreplay. $h!T on leads all over the place. (Well worth the aggravation though!) Drove me crazy!! Now it is SOP!!
Cheers,
Geary
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^ Sage wisdom in that there post by Geary!
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I don't like big caps hanging by their leads. Especially the big, heavy metal cased Russian caps. (and I use a ton of the Russkies!) I use small rectangles of acrylic sheet screwed to nylon stand-offs on the socket or strip screws. Simple. Dirt cheap! This provides a solid mounting surface, (zip tie down), elevates the caps above the circuitry to make troubleshooting far easier. My experience was that every time I had to move the caps "out of the way", ( or just simply lifting the plate to take a look!), I was running the risk of creating more issues with solder junctions, lead integrity and potential shorting.
I started doing this when I added the C4S upgrade to my Foreplay. $h!T on leads all over the place. (Well worth the aggravation though!) Drove me crazy!! Now it is SOP!!
Cheers,
Geary
Geary,
Would you happen to have an image of this? I can't really picture what you mean from your verbal description.
Thank you!!