upgrade path (a BH product discussion)

[denti alligator]

Crazy me, I'm already thinking about upgrades, and I haven't even received my Quickie yet. 

But I can dream, can't I? So discounting the BH DAC, which I'd definitely like to add to my system, ultimately I'd like to

- replace my Seduction with an Eros

- replace my Quickie with the new 300B preamp

- get Paramounts and use my SEX for 'phones

In what order would it make most sense to upgrade? Where would I get the most dramatic improvements first, keeping in mind the system I currently have?

[Doc B.]

First up, we got some quickie plates in and we just need to get them packed and shipped with the rest of our backlog, which is getting moved out as we get back into the groove after my mom's passing.

In terms of upgrades and such - I can't speak to questions about the delivery of the DAC with any certainty until I find out if the prototype I was told was trying to be completed by month's end is actually done. So I kinda have to shrug my shoulders on that one.

In terms of the rest of those ideas-

Get the Quickie and build it. We should probably have done it in a fancy case and charged $2500. Caelin Gabriel at Shunyata Research always tells me I'm crazy to sell things for so little money. He drives race cars, I struggle to figure out how to pay for a new transmission in my old Mercedes. So he may be right. Quickie sounds pretty darned nice and probably loses as many sales because it is $99 as it gets because it's $99.

Sed vs. Eros? Eros is a definite step up in a highly resolving system. I have felt that Seduction should be retired since we introduced Eros. But too many folks want the less expensive kit, so we seem to have a hard time retiring it.

Paramounts vs. S.E.X. ?  3X as much $ and to my ear easily 3X better. Be forewarned we are looking at a new production run on Paramount chassis plates (and S.E.X. plates too), so it would be a few weeks before we could ship.

[Jim R.]

Sam,

I think if it were me I'd probably go for the Eros first then the preamp and finally the paramounts (assuming that the s.e.x. is giving you all the volume you want out of the Klipschs.)

Of course it's all tempting, but the preamp is not available yet, and the paramounts will add a good bit of refinement to the sound (not that the s.e.x. is a slouch), and will probably get you some more dynamics but will still max out the volume long before the amp runs out of steam.

Anyway, just my opinion, for what it's worth, and all that, but my best guess is that you'll see a good improvement that you'll easily be able to hear and appreciate with the eros.

-- Jim

[earwaxxer]

I think I would agree with Jim. With the Klipsches I would focus on the tube power amps first, tube pre being second. Definately max out the Quickie before moving over to the 300B, or you will not really know what you are 'heading for' - I mean if its not broken dont fix it. The Quickie sounds significantly better when (modestly) modded. Modestly in terms of skill and money. I really dont think Doc was kidding when he said he could box the Quickie in a nice bling bling case and some boutique parts and sell it for $2500. 

[Noskipallwd]

Sam,
While I can't tell you what upgrades to make, I can relate my experience. Of all the BH gear I have built, 2 please me the most. The Eros, and the Quickie. The Eros is flat-out a fantastic phono pre. After building the Eros I have moved back to listening to vinyl 85 to 90 percent of the time. Recently I was able to listen to a Red Wine Audio Isabella, battery operated tube pre-amp. While it is a better sounding and more refined pre, the difference between it and the Quickie is amusingly close considering the price difference. The Isabella is $4000, and I have about $350 invested in my Quickie. I don't think you would have any regrets if you built either of these amps.

Cheers,
Shawn

[Paully]

Ok, let's muddy the waters.  Without question if I were doing this over again, as far as the Eros vs Seduction and Paramounts I would upgrade to the Paramounts first.  I can't say with certainty, only Doc and others could say, but I would be tempted to do the Foreplay IV next.  The difference between the Eros and Seduction was quite noticeable but I still think the Seduction is awesome for the price.  The last two are a toss up especially since we haven't heard the FP IV, but I would be heading for the Paramounts before any of it.

[earwaxxer]

Interesting comparisons (I'm a junkie for comparisons!). I also have been interested in and follow the Red Wine stuff for years, especially the Isabella.

[denti alligator]

Thanks, guys!

I don't have funds now, and probably won't for at least a year, if not longer, so these are future dreams. If the new Foreplay will have a second output like the old one, then I may go with that first, if only because it will allow me to keep my SEX hooked up for 'phones once I get the Paramounts. Otherwise I'd have to unplug and re-plug every time I wanted to listen to 'phones.

If only for that reason (admittedly trivial), I'm thinking this order for the upgrades:

FPIV --> Paramounts (I assume with my speakers, the 2A3 would sound best, no?) --> Eros --> MagneQuest Irons for Paramounts

[Grainger49]

Sam,

If the SEX amp drives your speakers to satisfying volumes you could just trick it out with MQ nickel transformers and choke plate.  Or go with the Paramounts and go all nickel and 45 output tubes.  I found that 45s drive my speakers to ear shattering volumes I would normally never listen to recently.  Power is about volume and dynamics, that is all. 

I think after a few years here we all know that a more expensive Bottlehead product will make a discernible difference to our ears.  Dan and Paul would have it no other way. 

As for asking about the Paramount 2A3s I think that the lower the power the sweeter it sounds.  So that is my reason for the suggestion for 45 output tubes at 1.75WPC.  Yes, I think the 2A3 is sweeter than the 300B, which is pretty sweet in its own right.

I'm sure that you can add a second output to the new preamp or Y-adapt it so you can use the SEX.

[denti alligator]

Doh! Y-adapter! Of course. So that makes things a little simpler.

1. Paramounts
2. FP IV
3. Eros
4. MQ iron for Paramounts
5. BH power cords

Alright, then. I'm looking at around 5K. An amount my wife would never let me spend. So I'll be pacing myself over, dunno, 10 years! 

[Paully]

That is what I would do, might flop 3 and 4, but it sounds like you have a couple of years to mull it over...  Do post back to this thread as you go along, it is fun to follow.

[denti alligator]

Will do.

I'm hoping to convince my wife to get me the Paramounts as a gift when/if I get tenure. That would be in about 2-3 years. But I also think we'll be looking to buy a house around that time, so ... all additional funds may be funneled into that. We'll see. I don't know if I can go that long without building another kit!