Tube recommendations for Paramount with Orca

[Horatio]

Hi, I am about to be the proud owner of a Paramount kit and have a set of Orca's (+ sub) on order. Thoughts have started to turn to which configuration / tubes would be the best fit for an eclectic taste in music that runs from Classical and Jazz through to dance / house.

I am currently considering EML Mesh 300b's but I was wondering if anyone had any other particular favourites that they would recommend as worth considering?

Thanks,

Bill

[mhardyman]

oog

A veritable tube rolling nightmare searching for the "best" and hoping...

Psvane 300B-TII are very nice and half the price of the EMLs.  Of course most tubes are going to be significantly cheaper than the EMLs anyway.

TJ 300B/n series is also a very good bottle.  I have run both in the Paramounts and like both.  Is one better than the other?  They offer different flavors in my opinion.

Instead of forking over huge bucks at the outset, work your way up through the more inexpensive tubes and see what you get.  Bottlehead supplies the EH 300B with their kits.  Give them a try.  I've also used the Shuguang 300B-98 with very good results and they are some of the cheapest out there.

You could buy several different series for what you will pay for the EML line and the EMLs may not be a happy fit in the Bottleheads.  I also have the Audio Note Single End Parallel "Legend" and they are just fine with the Shuggies.  I also use the DIY HiFi Ladyday 91 monoblocks and they shine with the TJ's!

as always, your mileage may vary

[Grainger49]

Generically there are tubes that Bottleheads like in their kits.  The problem is that all of us go for different things. 

I am a soundstage junkie.  I love for the speakers to "disappear" and voices and instruments to appear at points that have nothing to do with the speakers (per se).

Others are interested in dynamics, sparkle on the highs, a palpable midrange, kick ass bass.  The list is long and varied.

The question is, "What do you listen to most closely, what floats you boat about musical playback?"  With the answers to those two question others can tell you that XYZ tube brought out such and such detail in their systems.

Good luck!

[Gerry E.]

Good advice above, especially Grainger's point about personal preferences/priorities.  I have used all of the following in my Paramounts (in reverse order of preference):

1.  JJ.
2.  TJ Mesh.   
3.  EML Solid Plate.
4.  Sophia Royal Princess.
5.  Reissue Western Electric.

All work well and surprise(!), you pretty much get what you pay for.  If I were looking for the best value, I would probably get the TJ 300B/c (a.k.a. Sophia Carbon Princess).  If you shop around, you should be able to get them for about $450/pair. 

The reissue WE 300Bs that I'm currently using are only a little better than the Sophia Royal Princess.  The Carbon Princess probably gets you 90% of the performance of the Royal Princess for less than half the price.  That makes them look like a good deal to me.   
   
Gerry                       

[Horatio]

Many thanks for the answers - I think I will take mhardyman's advice and play the field a little with the tubes. I am going to give the EH 300b's a good listen to start with. I guess when it comes to musical taste my preference is a mix that swings from Classic, Singer Songwriter & Lounge (majority) at one end jumping to Deep House (less frequent) at the other so in some regards they are at either extremes. Having a wide soundstage and a strong feeling of presence for the former are likely to be near the top of my wish list as that will probably best match the majority of my listening time.

Gerry - I notice you do not have the EH 300b's on your list - did you not like them or simply not order them with the kit? What made you put the JJ's in the number 1 slot, out of interest which JJ's did you go for was it the 2A3-40's?

Thanks,

Bill

[marantzfan]

I think his list is in reverse order...  just from everything I have read...

[Gerry E.]

Gerry - I notice you do not have the EH 300b's on your list - did you not like them or simply not order them with the kit? What made you put the JJ's in the number 1 slot, out of interest which JJ's did you go for was it the 2A3-40's?

Thanks,

Bill

Marantzfan got it right - I had the tubes in reverse order of preference.  I have since updated my post by adding the word "reverse".

Bill - To answer your questions:

I purchased my Paramounts already built and they came with the TJ "mesh", so I never heard the stock EH 300Bs.  I purchased the JJ-300Bs for the BeePre but of course I tried them in the Paramounts.  They sound good and I wouldn't know any better had I not tried the other 300Bs on my list.

I just as easily could have rated the JJs ahead of the TJs.  Overall, the TJ is slightly better but loses a few points because I find them slightly bloated compared to the better 300Bs.  IMO, the EML, SRP and WE 300Bs are quite a bit better than the other two but they should be, they cost more.  In some cases, a lot more!   

Gerry                   

[Horatio]

Gerry, how would you compare the sonics of the Sophia Electric Royal (or Carbon) Princess and the EML?

Bill

[Gerry E.]

Gerry, how would you compare the sonics of the Sophia Electric Royal (or Carbon) Princess and the EML?

Bill

I find the Sophia Royal Princess (and presumably the Carbon Princess) to have better "tone" than the EML.  The EML can be a tiny bit hard sounding but only in comparison.

The WE 300B, both vintage and reissue, is considered to be the gold standard of 300Bs.  There are at least two excellent reviews comparing the SRP and WE 300Bs (see links below).  One by Jeff Day for Positive Feedback and the other by Jack Roberts for Dagogo. 

I feel that Jack Roberts really nailed it!  I'm basing this on hearing both sets of tubes in two different systems, mine and Boulos.  Note that we have different amps and different speakers.  That the Sophia 300Bs are even close to the WE is very high praise!  Especially when you factor in the cost differential.           

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue57/300B.htm

http://dagogo.com/sophia-electrics-royal-princess-300b-vacuum-tube-review

Gerry

[wullymc]

Has anyone tried the Genalex Gold Lion PX300B?  Any good?


Also, by swapping out the 5670 does it make that big an impact on sound?

Thanks!

[Paul Joppa]

Never discount the importance of the driver! There are not a lot of choices, but all the versions were "premium" of one sort or another so there are relatively few duds. There are a few variants optimized for longevity, instrumentation (stability), etc.

The Bendix "Red Bank" 6385 version is certainly the most exotic. I have never seen one. (Bendix also made a regular 2C51, I think.)

I can't even locate a data sheet for the 6854, which has a much larger heater current but that's all I know. Never seen one of those either.

Here's a thread with a long list of similar tubes:
http://www.audioasylum.com/cgi/t.mpl?f=tubes&m=239041

[Horatio]

Just wanted to say thanks for all the suggestions. After much deliberation and research I finally opted for the Sophia Electric Carbon Princess 300b's.

Thanks for all the help,

Bill

[Paully]

Has anyone tried the Genalex Gold Lion PX300B?  Any good?


Also, by swapping out the 5670 does it make that big an impact on sound?

Thanks!

I have asked about those "Gold Lion" tubes elsewhere and a while ago, I can't remember ever reading a post from someone who bought a pair.

[galyons]

The Gold Lions are very nice tubes.  Premium construction, less than premium price.  IMO, better than the JJ's  & TJ, carbon and mesh, in my system.  I also have Shuguang Treasure Z 300B's, black bottle.  They are a tough call as to which is better.  The Gold Lions have a bit stronger low end, the Treasures slightly smoother in the mids.  Both are nice and airy in the treble region.  Please bear in mind that I am using an old, (but extensively refurbished) pair of EV 3 way horns.  Not much bass below 50Hz and treble rolls off above 16K.  Everything in between is glorious. 

Cheers,
Geary

[Chris65]

I have the Genelex PX300B as well, but in my recently finished BeePre. No other 300B to compare but they do have a glorious mid-range. Got them as they were literally the cheapest I could find, yes I was very lucky!