Resistance/Voltage checks

troplin · 4574

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Offline troplin

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Reply #15 on: February 21, 2017, 12:33:40 PM
Well, you're 5% high on the heater voltage. You could go back to the manual and rewire for the next highest line voltage, then remeasure. 

5% isn't going to hurt anything though.

If I rewire the power transformer, that's going to affect all voltages, not just the heater voltage, right?

The power transformer is currently wired for 230V +/-5V, so with the actual voltage being 232V the values should theoretically be within spec. Could this also be caused by bad solder joints or incorrectly installed parts? And if yes, which ones are most likely?

In any case I'll wait for my new multimeter to take all measurements before changing anything.

Tobias


Offline Paul Birkeland

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Reply #16 on: February 21, 2017, 01:01:31 PM
Yeah, these could just be off because of meter problems. I'd start by measuring your wall voltage with the new meter, then check everything else.

Paul "PB" Birkeland

Bottlehead Grunt & The Repro Man


Offline troplin

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Reply #17 on: February 22, 2017, 09:49:51 AM
Ok, new measurements with new meter, the high voltage terminals are also all around 5% off (too high).


AC measurements:
================
Terminal              | VAC
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Power line            | 233
PT Terminal 7 to 9    | 6.44
PT Terminal 11 to 12  | 183 initially, sinking to 175.6 steady state

Resistance / DC measurements
============================
Terminal     | Ohm expected  | Ohm measured | VDC expected  | VDC measured
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1            | 0             | 0.9          |               |
2            | *             | INF          | 65-95         | 86.0
3            | 880           | 889          | 15-18         | 17.88
4            | 249K          | 249.3K       | 0             | 0.045
5            | 0             | 1.0          | 0             | 0
6            | *             | INF          | 385           | 407
7            | *             | INF          | 400           | 425
8            | 0             | 0.9          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9            | 0             | 1.0          |               |
10           | *             | INF          | 380           | 408
11           | 680           | 669          |               |
12           | 0             | 0.8          |               |
13           | *             | INF          |               |
14           | 0             | 1.0          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
15           | 0             | 1.0          |               |
16           | *             | INF          | 65-95         | 94.78
17           | 880           | 886          | 15-18         | 17.59
18           | 249K          | 250.5K       | 0             | 0.029
19           | 0             | 0.9          | 0             | 0
20           | *             | INF          | 385           | 408
21           | *             | INF          | 400           | 424
22           | 0             | 0.9          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
23           | 0             | 0.9          |               |
24           | *             | INF          | 380           | 402
25           | 680           | 667          |               |
26           | 0             | 1.0          |               |
27           | *             | INF          |               |
28           | 0 (INF!)      | INF          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
29           | 0 (INF!)      | INF          |               |
30           | *             | 110          |               |
31           | *             | 110          |               |
32           | *             | 110          |               |
33           | *             | INF          |               |
34           | *             | 10M rising   |               |
35           | *             | 2M sinking   |               |
36           | 0             | 0.9          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
H1           | 0             | 0.7          |               |
H2           | *             | 110          | +/-2.8-3.2    | 3.40
H3           | *             | 5.5K         |               |
H4           | *             | 110          | +/-2.8-3.2    | -3.26
H5           | *             | 110          | +/-2.8-3.2    | 3.40
H6           | *             | 5.5K         |               |
H7           | *             | 110          | +/-2.8-3.2    | -3.26
H8           | 0             | 0.7          |               |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RCA R Center | 90K-115K      | 104.9K       |               |
RCA L Center | 90K-115K      | 101.9K       |               |
RCA R Ground | 0             | 0.9          |               |
RCA L Ground | 0             | 0.9          |               |


Am I good to go?
Is this likely because of bad soldering or component variance?
Should I rewire for 240V?
« Last Edit: February 22, 2017, 09:55:08 AM by troplin »

Tobias


Offline Paul Birkeland

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Reply #18 on: February 22, 2017, 08:09:39 PM
What's your voltage between pins 1 and 12 on one of the 12 pin sockets with both tubes installed?

Paul "PB" Birkeland

Bottlehead Grunt & The Repro Man


Offline troplin

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Reply #19 on: February 23, 2017, 04:57:12 AM
What's your voltage between pins 1 and 12 on one of the 12 pin sockets with both tubes installed?

That's 6.45 VDC.

Tobias


Offline troplin

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Reply #20 on: February 24, 2017, 09:22:21 AM
That's 6.45 VDC.

Any feedback on that number, PB?
I guess it's safe to at least try it out?
Man, it's so difficult not to be impatient with that amp just sitting there and teasing me...

Tobias


Offline Natural Sound

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Reply #21 on: February 24, 2017, 03:03:04 PM
Any feedback on that number, PB?
I guess it's safe to at least try it out?
Man, it's so difficult not to be impatient with that amp just sitting there and teasing me...

According to the GE datasheet this voltage should be 6.3v +-  0.6v or 5.7v to 6.9v. Your measurement of 6.45v is within that range.

http://www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/sheets/093/6/6FJ7.pdf



Offline troplin

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Reply #22 on: February 25, 2017, 01:24:57 AM
According to the GE datasheet this voltage should be 6.3v +-  0.6v or 5.7v to 6.9v. Your measurement of 6.45v is within that range.

http://www.mif.pg.gda.pl/homepages/frank/sheets/093/6/6FJ7.pdf

Hey Natural Sound, thanks for that link.
It seems that the tube has quite some tolerance.

I couldn't wait any longer and put it into service, together with the new Blumenstein Orcas. It's working fine. I might still make some corrections but for now it seems ok.

The new combo replaces a Cambridge SoundWorks 2.1 system for my computer.
But to be quite honest, I don't yet know which one I like better sound wise. They certainly sound different. But the old system also seems to be quite good (but it's not mine).
If nothing else, the SEX/Orca combo looks way better. ;D

Tobias


Offline Natural Sound

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Reply #23 on: February 25, 2017, 04:26:34 AM
Hey Natural Sound, thanks for that link.
It seems that the tube has quite some tolerance.

I couldn't wait any longer and put it into service, together with the new Blumenstein Orcas. It's working fine. I might still make some corrections but for now it seems ok.

The new combo replaces a Cambridge SoundWorks 2.1 system for my computer.
But to be quite honest, I don't yet know which one I like better sound wise. They certainly sound different. But the old system also seems to be quite good (but it's not mine).
If nothing else, the SEX/Orca combo looks way better. ;D

If the Orca's are new they will take some time to reach their full potential. The same goes for your new S.E.X. 3.0. Also, here is a tip I got from Clark Blumenstein a few years ago that might help.

Quote
Initially, the Orcas aren't going to be making a ton of bass, so you'll
want to have them with their backs pretty close to the wall to reinforce
the majority of what comes out of their port. As time goes on, you'll hear
them becoming a bit boomy so you'll want to begin pulling them out a little
bit more as time goes on.…

For what its worth I have an old Cambridge SoundWorks 2.1 system for my computer as well. Mine is from back in the days when Henry Kloss was still alive and designing for them. It does sound very good indeed. But in my humble opinion there are no match for a S.E.X./Orca setup. Especially when you add a Blumenstein sub.

Enjoy!



Offline tsingle999

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Reply #24 on: February 25, 2017, 02:58:03 PM
The Orcas sound their best after a few hundred hours. Play them loud.
 I recently put some old desktop speakers (Scirocco s30) back in to compare to Orca's and the Orcas are so much more lifelike it was no comparison. Its always fun to compare to old things that you thought sounded really good. But YMMV as everyone has their own preferences.

SGS iTransporter with Qobuz & Roon to Optical Rendu to BH DAC (Battery) / Wavelegth Cosecant to BeePre to 300b(ehemoths) to Jagers.
Bottlehead Stat headphone amp with Wavelength Brick DAC


Offline troplin

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Reply #25 on: February 26, 2017, 12:20:46 AM
If the Orca's are new they will take some time to reach their full potential. The same goes for your new S.E.X. 3.0.
The Orcas sound their best after a few hundred hours. Play them loud.

Yeah, the ominous "break in".  :D
I don't really enjoy music too loud at the moment though as I've often got headaches since 1-2 years.
And my room leaves much to be desired. Reverb time (RT60) is about 1s, which I find very fatiguing. Everything seems loud. And there seem to be some nasty standing waves.

For what its worth I have an old Cambridge SoundWorks 2.1 system for my computer as well. Mine is from back in the days when Henry Kloss was still alive and designing for them. It does sound very good indeed. But in my humble opinion there are no match for a S.E.X./Orca setup. Especially when you add a Blumenstein sub.
I recently put some old desktop speakers (Scirocco s30) back in to compare to Orca's and the Orcas are so much more lifelike it was no comparison. Its always fun to compare to old things that you thought sounded really good. But YMMV as everyone has their own preferences.

That's true, often switching to something better is not a big deal, but switching back to something inferior makes a huge difference.

I'm really not an audiophile, I just enjoy music. All that jargon (soundstage, resolution, tight bass, etc) doesn't tell me much, I can just tell if I like something or not. And sometimes even that is difficult.

Tobias


Offline Paul Birkeland

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Reply #26 on: February 27, 2017, 06:07:42 AM
Yes, 6.45V is less than 3% off of the nominal, so you're OK.

Paul "PB" Birkeland

Bottlehead Grunt & The Repro Man


Offline troplin

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Reply #27 on: February 28, 2017, 10:02:31 AM
Yes, 6.45V is less than 3% off of the nominal, so you're OK.

Ok, thanks PB.
Now that difference between the added voltages H2 + H4 (3.40+3.26 = 3.66V), and the effective heater voltage (3.45V), where does it come from?
Is this likely an error of my meter measuring the unfiltered "DC" voltages coming from the rectifier?

Tobias


Offline Doc B.

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Reply #28 on: February 28, 2017, 10:09:43 AM
The difference could be due to a shift in line voltage, meter inconsistency, or operator error.  The bottom line is you have 6.45V and that is fine. Put on some music and enjoy it.

Dan "Doc B." Schmalle
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Bottlehead Corp.


Offline troplin

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Reply #29 on: February 28, 2017, 10:43:49 AM
Put on some music and enjoy it.

Sure, I'm enjoying the music as I'm writing, just as I did most of the time in the past few days.
But that doesn't hinder me from asking annoying questions. ;)

I'm just trying to understand a bit what I'm doing.
It's almost embarassing to admit that I've actually a degree in electrical engineering (more IT though), so I should actually understand at least the basics. But I never actually worked in that area, so I've already forgot most of it, which is a bit sad.

Tobias