Advice on base finishes

[Armaegis]

On my old Crack I used a lighter Minwax stain which turned out ok. More recently I tried a minwax dark walnut gloss but am not as happy with it. Both the colour and shine are sorta inconsistent. Granted I'm not a great woodworker, but this darker one seemed more difficult to work with than the light stain.

I goofed on one of the sides and had to redo it, which was a huge pain. Sandpaper was gumming up, so I had to use steel wool to scratch the worst of it off before I could smooth things back down with the paper.

Is there a level of smoothness which works best before staining? I was going down to 400 which felt nice. I tried some 600 which did feel smoother, but it looked like the wood was going grey (leaving sand grit in the wood grain itself?)

[howardnair]

 a book-and web site  http://www.michaeldresdner.com/
dyes work well and can be stained after sealing--wipe on poly can give a excellent finish but it takes about 6 to 10 thin coats-after dying and or staining spray shellac can be used--spray shellac has no wax in it --i use a couple  coats of sanding sealer or spray shellac before using wipe on poly-wipe it on lightly and let it dry- sand with 220 to 320-again and again--in some woods the pores will continue to absorb -so using a pore filler is needed if you are looking for a fine finish-i have made dyes from tubes of pigment from the paint department of the local yard-they mix with water or other mediums easily-dresdner has a  new book- The new Wood Finishing book --very informative-i have several of his books they are more than helpful-i just bought a second stereomour and some very blond mahogany-i will dye this with a yellow pigment--it will be a all- wood chassis -somewhat similar to the bloodwood one i made in october-but i don't think the trannie cover will be rounded-not really sure at this point-howie

[tuffy_puppy]

in the past i have built a number of kayaks (wooden).  for a finish i have used spar varnish with uv inhibitors.  this applied over an epoxy coat rolled out with a foam roller.  and rolled out. and rolled out. and rolled out etc.  get it smoother than a baby's butt.  dry for a few days.  and then the spar varnish (with uv inhibitors).  foam brush.  do this until it is pleasing to your eye.  my guru for this was   john lockwood,  pygmy kayaks, port townsend,  washington................you may look at this effect online.  my kayaks are a good ten years old and are still gorgeous!!      don pettit, long beach, washington

[Jim R.]

Don,

Sounds beautiful!  Wish I could see the pics.

Do you cold-mold or build ply 'yaks (with something like Bruynzeel ply)?  Round bottom, lapstrake or hard-chine?  How long are they?

Wood boats of all sorts are a passion, though living in the Rocky Mountains, nowhere near real water, makes them somewhat impractical for me now.

-- Jim

[tuffy_puppy]

hey jim,  i had hoped that i was using the forum correctly.  here in our soggy nw climate alder grows like a weed and is extremely soft.  so it can ding very easily.  forgot that when i opened my new extended foreplay 3 recently.  put a small fingernail mark right up front.  if i were going to put the kit together the first thing i would have done would have been would have been to finish the alder pieces the way i mentioned.  makes it hard as hell and can be very easily refinished.  that is the way i finished my two pygmy kits.  try going on line and seeing what can be done.  great stuff!!  pygmy kayaks. com........the other two boats are what is called skin- on-frame kayaks.  west greenland style(there are other styles).  construct a frame of fir with oak ribs and wrap it in #10 canvas cotton duck.  sew a seam down the top and get in the water.  much more of course but that's the idea.  cheated and fastened all joints with epoxy rather than traditional doweling and lashing(and yes that makes me a chicken)............the greenland boats are hard-chined.  the pygmy boats are a series of soft chines.  the greenland boats are 17' 6".  the wooden boats are 15' 8".  at the pygmy site you will see many different lengths of boats. jim,  please let me know how to use this forum properly.  i am old and my wife has to do for me anything more complex on the computer than to construct an email.  do not ever  intend to build any kind of kit but am a confirmed bottlehead.  thanks,  don pettit,  long beach, washington.............maybe 175 miles south of doc's place,  mouth of the columbia river

[Grainger49]

Back in the 70s when I was working on furniture spar varnish didn't get a hard finish, it stayed tacky.  Does it harden now?

[tuffy_puppy]

hey grainger,  it is the epoxy that sets like a stone.  the varnish is to tint and allow for refinishing after i bang it up and i do.  i haven't noticed the varnish being tacky.  cold sea water??  anyway would you mind letting me know that you see this?  i do not know how this works and am wandering around in the dark here.  thanks, don

[Jim R.]

Hey Don,

Just so you know, the reason I can't see the pics is because I'm blind, not necessarily because they didn't post.  Sorry, I forget that not everybody is aware of that.

BTW, back in 1984 I was on a wooden boat pilgrimage to Maine and came dangerously close to buying a fully restored Rushton Princess sailing canoe.  Even back then it was close to $4000.  I have no idea what they're worth today, but this was an immaculate specimen.  Not really suitable for the Columbia River though :-).

-- Jim

[tuffy_puppy]

so jim,  must be using a braille system, huh?  me?  i still have one eye left.  guess we have all the fun, huh?.........please tell me about your stuff (audio) when time allows, ok?  i use audio nirvana super 12s for speakers.  a decware cd player.  my computer streaming and that is it!  oh yeah,  and i hum a lot.  please tell me more about your bottlehead addiction.  don pettit, long beach, washington

[Jim R.]

Don,

Nope, I use a screen reader for my computer -- reads the screen back to me in a synthesized voice.  I lost my sight when I was 31, so not a fluent braille reader.

I'll send you PM about my system and other goodies so as to not go too far astray with this thread.

-- Jim