First day listening impressions with my Stereomour

wilberforce · 4589

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Warning: this post will probably get very lengthy.

This morning I completed my build of my Stereomour around 10:30 AM. You can see it here:

http://www.bottlehead.com/smf/index.php/topic,1900.0.html

I hooked it up to my system (details at end of post) and spent the whole day listening.

I live in an apartment building which has very thick walls, but not so thick ceilings. I listened at very moderate levels up to 7:00 pm out of courtesy to the fellow who lives upstairs, works nights and sleeps during the day.

Therefore, we'll have low level impressions, and BLASTING impressions.

I had read lots of accolades for SET amps, and in particular, SET amps based on 2A3 tubes for a long time. I had never heard one, but after reading so many praises (one man reported tearing up over the sound of Allison Krauss' voice on first listen of a 2A3 SET), I was intrigued, to say the least.

Things are different now. Back in my college days, the local music store in a little college town in Wyoming stocked and could demonstrate, JBL, Advent, Cerwin Vega, Marantz, etc., etc. Where can I go hear an esoteric amp like the Stereomour. Faith is required.

I adapt. I gave up on trying to listen to studio monitors in a noisy Guitar Center environment, and a few years ago bought an $1,100 pair of Adam A7s on the internet without ever hearing them. It worked out, I never even considered returning them.

But now I want to try out this esoteric SET tube amp without ever hearing one, AND, I have to put it together. OK, I did it. That's the background. Now, on to the listening impressions.

My very first impression was that, although it was clean, and amazingly functioning despite that fact that *I* was the person who assembled it, it didn't sound all that different from the Sherwood S-5000II that had been driving these speakers before.

Wrong. First impressions are important, but not always accurate. My impressions of the Stereomour changed throughout the day, but always for the better.

I was listening at low levels, around 70 - 75 dB. I noticed that the low end was different. At first, I thought that there was less bass than with the Sherwood. Is there less bass, or is it tighter, better defined? At least now I'm hearing that it IS a different sound from the Sherwood. Conclusion? The Sherwood's bass is bloated and boomy. It's a push-pull amp, and a great amp of it's day, but as an integrated amp, it also has tone controls, and how can one know that it's truly flat even though the controls are set at zero?

I spent time pondering this change in low end, and mind you, I was listening at low levels, to very polite music. Chamber music. String quartets, piano trios, that sort of thing.

I spent most of the day, being limited in my volume levels, to polite classical music. It wasn't a chore, I like this stuff. I came to believe that this sort of low end is probably flatter than what the Sherwood had been giving me. Indeed, with these big speakers, and the Sherwood's 36 watts a channel, and a fairly small room, there was boominess before. Not now.

I tuned into the bass. I hate subjective descriptions full of lush, creamy mids with an aftertaste of oak, but this bass was definitely more DEFINED.

In fact, many things were more defined. I remember people describing their SET amps and talking about definition, but I HEARD it today.

Yes, some low level things were popping out that I hadn't heard before. There's a bit of the BBC nature recordings of the bird you hear toward the end of "Blackbird" that I hadn't heard before. It's very, very low, and comes in before the one that you notice right away.

Other details in Blackbird: the metronome sounds so much more like a metronome. When I heard it the first time on lo-fi in 1968, I assumed they mic'ed him tapping his foot. Later I read that it was a metronome, but it still sounded like a tapping foot. No doubt with the Stereomour, it's a metronome.

Another new detail: Paul's voice is double tracked, very subtlety, but the level of the double track is raised on the choruses.

Well, it went on like that, and here's my conclusion on the difference in sound (finally!):

What I noticed is a tremendous increase in the reproduction of attack transients. This may be what people are referring to when they say that SET amps have more DETAIL. Some of the detail may come from the fact that the bass is flatter, but I was hearing the details of attack transients like I haven't heard outside of the recording studio.

Attack transients are the very beginning part of a sound. The pick on the string, the stick on the cymbal, the rosin on the bow. It's the sizzle. It's high energy, high frequency sound, and very difficult to reproduce. But I heard them all over the place today.

Patsy Cline. This stuff was recorded in the early sixties, and today was the first time I noticed that the bass player was using a pick.

I've got some Cuban folkloric music, Yoruba religious stuff, and you could hear every calloused thumb hitting those bat
« Last Edit: June 12, 2011, 06:55:07 PM by wilberforce »



Offline InfernoSTi

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
    • Posts: 271
  • Positive emotions enhance our musical experiences.
Reply #1 on: June 12, 2011, 07:55:10 PM
Nice write-up, very honest and informative.  Thank you...

I, too, have the Stereomour driving speakers I built myself.  At first I thought it was all proud poppa but it seems everyone has a similar experience, each with his own words and all with different speakers/rooms/source.  There really is something to this amp, isn't there?

Enjoy the music!
John

John Kessel
Hawthorne Audio AMT K2 Reference Speakers
Paramount 300B w/MQ All Nickel Iron,  Mundorf S/G 5.5 uF,  and  Vcap Teflon .1 uF
Auralic Taurus Preamp/Auralic Vega DAC/Auralic Aries Streamer
and lots of room treatments!


Offline Grainger49

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • Posts: 7175
Reply #2 on: June 13, 2011, 06:15:08 AM
Wilber,

Sounds like you and I were in college at the same time.  Not to mention the overlap in musical taste.  I'd like to know where to get some of the Cuban folkloric music you mention for a sampling.

The Stereomour is a step up from the stock Paramour (1) kits that I built about 6 years ago.  One of the big steps forward is PJ's new iron on the output, and I'm guessing, plate choke. 

I have made many modifications since including Doc's recommended MQ iron.  Not to mention every capacitor in it.  I'm a self professed capacitor junkie.

Thanks for the write up.  The word I often hear and now understand is "immediacy."  There is a lifelike presence in the mids and highs in SET amps.  That in addition to the more accurate bass reproduction adds to the illusion that someone is in the room.  I'm also a self professed imaging junkie too and this is something I recognized as a tube attribute from my first listening to good tubed equipment in the 70s.

Enjoy!



Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Reply #3 on: June 13, 2011, 09:22:31 AM
Wilber,

Sounds like you and I were in college at the same time.  Not to mention the overlap in musical taste.  I'd like to know where to get some of the Cuban folkloric music you mention for a sampling.

Mid-Seventies.

Here's a link to the group I was listening to--click on a sample and see if it's your cup of tea. The Orun Seco piece is instrumental. The polyrhythms can get quite disorienting, it's really advanced stuff, rhythmically.

http://www.amazon.com/Obatala-Abbilona/dp/B000QZXOOS/ref=sr_1_16_digr?ie=UTF8&qid=1307992551&sr=8-16



Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Reply #4 on: June 13, 2011, 01:27:46 PM
I'm a self professed capacitor junkie.

What capacitors are your favorites? How did they change the sound?

What about tubes? Are you using other than the stock tubes?



Offline Grainger49

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • Posts: 7175
Reply #5 on: June 14, 2011, 03:17:31 AM
Tubes and capacitors are a matter of personal taste.  For instance a number of posters on the old board liked some capacitors I really disliked.  But, since you asked...

As for capacitors I guess it depends on where in the circuit.  For signal path I like to use KK Teflons.  They are not available in large values (0.22uF max) but do go up to 600V.  They impart an ultra clean sound to the high frequencies and an improved presence in the midrange.  I don't listen much to bass improvements.

I have Mundorf, I think Silver Oil, in my Foreplay.  I have Obbligato Film/Oil (the black cheapest) as 10uF Parafeed caps in my Paramours.  These give a smoothness to the sound that is very pleasing to me.  And despite my previous statement I think there was an improvement in the bass.  I received a recommendation from another Bottlehead and now recommend them to other Bottleheads.  Several have been knocked over with the sound improvement and how incredibly cheap they are.  Don't let the price make you think they are not good sounding.

My Seduction has a 2.2uF Obbligato, same kind as above, bypassed with a 0.1uF@200V KK Teflon for the output and a 0.1uF KK Teflon for the interstage.  All these are audio signal path caps.

In power supplies I like Oilers, that is a motor run/start cap.  I have even used the same inexpensive Obbligato caps in power supplies.  Doc and PJ select their electrolytic power supply caps well (just about all caps in the Eros is hard to upgrade because of their careful selection).  There are some better electrolytic caps you can buy for power supplies but you might as well go with something more exotic.

Tubes, I'm the Will Rogers of tubes, I like them all but I like some more than others (sound like Animal Farm?)  A current favorite is JAN Sylvania tubes from the 60s and 70s.  I also like the USSR Military Surplus equivalents for my Seduction (6N23P).  I am using a 76 rather than 12AT7 in my Paramour amps.  You can't do that in the Stereomour.  But I have changed my output tubes to Chinese 2A3Cs which cost ~$100 a pair.  They are a step up from the Sovteks and not nearly as expensive as the exotic tubes a number of other Bottleheads have invested in.  I'm not working so I don't spend that much for items, look under my avatar.

I hope this ramble helps.



Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Reply #6 on: June 14, 2011, 08:30:39 AM
Ha, I'm an audio cheapskate as well.

Would those be the Shuguang 2A3C tubes?



Offline Grainger49

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • Posts: 7175
Reply #7 on: June 14, 2011, 10:57:19 AM
Yes, those are the tubes I liked very much for the price.



Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Reply #8 on: June 14, 2011, 12:36:23 PM
Thanks for the tips on tubes and caps. When "upgraditis" sets in, I'll know where to start. First, I'm going to get good and used to the stock sound, which is evolving a bit as things burn in.



Offline astroimage2002

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 41
Reply #9 on: June 14, 2011, 03:15:57 PM
If your ears are ringing... you are messing up the most important thing. YOUR EARS! Turn the thing down and listen!

Brian



Offline wilberforce

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • Posts: 33
Reply #10 on: June 15, 2011, 07:41:25 AM
If your ears are ringing... you are messing up the most important thing. YOUR EARS! Turn the thing down and listen!

Brian


My ears got messed up years ago. I've been a professional musician since the age of fifteen, and have worked in recording studios for thirty years.

These days I do take it easy most of the time. BUT! When you've just completed building something as sweet as the Stereomour, some full throttle blasting is allowed, no, de rigueur!