Anyone know anything about UPS units?

[Laudanum]

I had the HT UPS fail this past weekend.  This is an APC unit with filtering, surge, AVR and pure sine wave UPS.   These list for $1400+ and sell for about $800.  The silver units were discontuned a couple years ago and I grabbed one when they were blown out at $299.   Cool thing about the unit is with our LED back-lit LCD TV we can get close to 1 1/2 hours of TV wathcing off this thing if the power goes out.

Anyway, power went out Saturday for a few seconds and the unit didnt kick in.  Went to alarm status saying "Inverter Overload"  contact APC.   If the unit sits off for a while, it will pass self test and seems to work fine.  But unplug power and it wont go into battery back up and gives the same fault warning.  If it's been running and warm, it wont pass self test on reboot and goes right to the "inverter overload" fault display.  With battery removed, it works fine but gives flashing no battery warning (obviously).  

2 year warranty and it's under warranty still but contacting APC, I can tell they dont want to deal with it although they have to under warranty and will.   The "tech" stated that it is almost always the battery when that fault condition flashes.  The batteries are 7 years old as the unit was built in 2005 and Im sure they didnt replace batteries at the close-out prices.   They are sending me a replacement battery pack.  

The question is ... does this sound right?   I would think that an inverter overload warning would indicate a problem on the inverter output, not the battery input side.  The unit also is equipped with a replace battery and/or low battery warning or other battery faults and none of those are showing up.  I would think that would show up if it were the batteries.   By the way, this is a 48 volt system (4 x 12 volt 7AH batteries in series).  Battery voltage measures 52+ volts as would be expected.  I realize that voltage doesnt tell the whole story about battery conditions.  But again, Im skeptical that the fault is with the batteries and/or the input side of the inverter.  And no, the output isnt overloaded, it does the same with no load or a lamp connected.  


Any thoughts or insights appreciated.

Thanks

[Wanderer]

Have some experiance with UPS, big 'uns for computer/server rooms. Battery strings are replaced  in our large Liebert units about every 5 years. Electrolytic capacitors have a service life of 10 years and we are about due on a recap on two of our units.       

At 7 years you have walked off the end of the SLA battery life. A replacment battery pack would be needed even if there is another fault. I bet you even money that the battery pac will fix it.

Assuming the battery does the trick I would start looking over the next couple years for another "deal" on a replacement UPS. I'd expect at circa 10 years or so you will start to see aging out of other, potentially expensive, parts in your unit.         

 

[Jim R.]

Desmond,

That is exactly what  an APC UPS does when the battery is shot.  I'll echo the others who say that the battery pack will undoubtedly fix the problem.

If and when you go looking to replace it, I'd strongly suggest a unit made by Eaton PowerWare -- much better in everyway than APC.

I have plenty of experience with APC units going back to the 80s and at least you can replace he battries on most of them nowadays :-).

HTH,

Jim

[Laudanum]

Thanks gents.   This APC is still under warranty by 2 months.  APC is shipping me a new battery pack for free.   Hope y'all are right and the new battery fixes it.   I just didnt think the battery made sense but I know little about these units.   When it does bite the dust, something affordable will have to replace it.   I'll definitely look into Eaton when the time comes.  
I have to give some credit to the APC though ... this unit replaced an APC H15 which is about the same thing but without UPS.  The TV was always plugged into either the H15 or this S15.  Right now, Im using a Brick Wall temporarily for surge protection.   The TV picture was noticeably better with the S15 (or H15).   I do not run the satellite coax through the unit so whatever filtering it does to the line does indeed improve picture quality.   It's not night and day but it does make a difference.   I've had no complaints at $299 and I still wont have any if the battery takes care of the fault.  The longer this thing lives on the happier I will be   

Thanks again gents.  

[Lar]

I use the APC  S - 15 was just wondering if you have the latest firmware updates on yours? Might make a difference, might not. 

[Laudanum]

Hi Larry.   Im not using it as a smart ups (I think thats the term) so I dont think the firmware should matter. Right?   It was running fine for 22 months until we had one of our short term power failures last saturday, and that was all she wrote.  We have them all the time, just had one 5 minutes ago in fact and little UPS I have connected kept the desktop im on right now up and running.  Power shuts off and back on in a matter of a second or two.  In fact,  we had one just a day or two before the one on Saturday and the S15 UPS kicked in fine on that one.   

Those quick on-offs that we have so frequently is the main reason why I grabbed the S15 when it was on closeout (the silver units).   I used to cringe every time the power would shut off and on watching the TV shut off and on ... sometimes 5 or 6 times in a matter of a 20 seconds or less.   Figured that cant be good for the TV or much of anything else for that matter.   Battery pack comes today so I should know for sure whether it's the battery or not this evening or tomorrow.  Keeping my fingers crossed.  If I have to ship this thing to APC, it's gonna cost a bunch.

Thanks

[Grainger49]

   .  .  .   It was running fine for 22 months until we had one of our short term power failures last Saturday, and that was all she wrote.  .  .  .   

Desmond,

It probably died before last Saturday but you didn't find out till last Saturday. 

I will throw in with all the others.  Logic says if the batteries failed to charge, died, then you get no AC when the power goes out.  Most likely a set of fresh batteries will make it fine again.

[Laudanum]

Hey Grainger.  Im hoping it's the batteries, I'll know today or tomorrow.  But what I was saying was just a couple days before it quit, we had one of our short power outs and it kicked in and worked fine.   The batteries arent dead by the way.  4 x 12V wired in series and I metered them at 52+ volts so there may be something wrong with a battery/batteries or cell/cells, but they arent dead.   Also, when I did get the unit to pass the power on test, it showed the battery charge at 95%.  It never showed a recharge battery, or low battery or replace battery warning and I believe it has the capability to show all of them.   These are the reasons why I was skeptical that it was the batteries at fault.  But I feel better now that several have chimed in indicating that they think the new battery pack will solve it.  Thats what the APC tech said as well.  I'll find out for sure very soon.

Thanks

[Grainger49]

I am caught up with you now.  Yes, probably a bad cell or cells.  A complete replacement should do wonders.

[Laudanum]

Replacement battery pack in and UPS passed test and seem to back up and running normally 

Thanks gents!!!

[Jim R.]

Desmond,

Good news.  Also voltage is no indication of how good a battery pack is and I seriously doubt that the cheaper APC units have the kind of circuitry needed to do a real battery condition test -- which really has to be done under heavy load.

Anyway, glad it's all working.

-- Jim

[Laudanum]

Apparently this units battery condition test indicates a bad battery pack by scrolling "Inverter Overload" and then not running.  Excellent forewarning.