Advice/Opinions wanted ** Newbie alert **

[Mike F1]

Hello,

I'm seeking some advice and opinions into the world of Vinyl.
As a kid I grew up listening to a Dual 1210 and a Sansui amp... from what I remembered it sounded okay and now I want to try some seroius vinyl.

Soooo, I've been saving up to purchase something frivolous for myself....

Here is a list of the turntables I'm interesting in:

- Rega P2 (or the P3/24 if I can scrape together a more few bucks)
- Pro-Ject Xpression II
- Music Hall MMF-5.1
- Thorens TD 240

Also purchasing a Seduction kit to go along with this.

Up until now all of my music is played though 2 year old Toshiba DVD/CD player a 8 year old Sony CD player.

My system includes:

Foreplay 2 with 6SN7's
Paramour's with Iron Upgrade
(a stereo, series feed, 6DN7's with TFA 204 OT's)
Mission 761 (made in the UK)
Paradigm 12 powered sub



Will any of these turntable's (and good cartridge) sound as good or better as a CD player or do I need to spend more $$$?
Is +/-$1000 entering the realm of quality sound or am I way off?

Thanks for your input

Mike
(A bit Clueless in Langley, BC)

[Paul Birkeland]

I think you're heading in a good direction.  I would personally opt for the MMF-5.  You will get a good complete package that is affordable, and it's not super hard to swap out the arm/cart later if you so desire. 

Having said that, any of these tables properly setup should be a leg up on your CD/DVD player.

[ssssly]

I second CBs recommendation. I just upgraded my turntable and was looking at much the same list. After looking at all of those tables I chose the MMF5.1 from that group.

I actually ended up going with a used VPI HW19 with an upgraded RB-250 arm and am absolutely thrilled with it.

For new at the price point of those tables though, I liked the MMF5.1 the best.

[Grainger49]

Yes, if you purchase a good cartridge the tables listed will beat our the CD player.  But please remember, the turntable turns the LP, the arm carries the cartridge and the cartridge produces the signal.

The cartridge is most important.  And cartridges have greater differences in sound from one to another than do tables or arms.

[sl-15]

I am not familiar with any of the turntables you are interested in but would like to make another suggestion without wanting to get into a debate about turntables. I myself use a Technics SL-1200MK2. There has been endless debate for a few years now if this table is worthy for audiophile use or not as it is most commonly used by DJs. I do like the Technics for its ease of use and upgrade options. The biggest advantage though in my opinion is that it has a removable headshell. It makes it very easy to swap out cartridges and I totally agree with Grainger that the differences in Cartridges are huge. With the pretty low cost of the Technics you might have money left to play around with different cartridges. The Technics is a very sturdy deck and because it has gotten more and more popular in the audiophile world there is quite a few used models out there that have not been abused by DJs. If you want to get more info on a Technics check the Vinylengine website there is a Technics board. I also found valuable info at the kabusa Website (no affiliation). Anyways if you decide to go the vinyl route with a Seduction you can't go wrong (I would get the essential C4S upgrade for it as well). In my opinion vinyl is more rewarding then CDs not just for the nicer sound but also for the way you handle vinyl. You can choose the songs more direct, you actually see them on the vinyl, the artwork is much nicer the list could be endless. In my opinion it is just more "organic" for the lack of a better word.

[Grainger49]

Stefan is right, the C4S gives you more gain and lower noise.  It also gives greater isolation from the power supply to the audio circuits.

And Santana's first LP, Santana, with all the faces and the naked woman on the cover is lost on a CD jewel box.  Ok, anyone can see the two nekkid women on the second album, Abraxas, even on the CD. 

The Technics is a very quiet table, low in rumble.  Don't discount the detachable headshell, do consider a viscous trough, I don't remember the Technics term for it.

BTW, I am familiar with the Rega and like them.  

[Mudhiker]

Direct Drive doesn't get much respect but if you just want to spin some records and enjoy the music without a bunch of fiddling... I have an old Realistic that I picked up for $50 and I'm loving it.

[Mike F1]

Hello,

Thanks for all the advice. You all gave me some good food for thought!
Upon reading a few more online reviews I'm leaning towards the Music Hall turntable. It seems to have some nice features that the others on my list don't have.
It comes with a Goldring 1012gx MM Cartridge.

Is there a good "on-line" store for purchasing a TT and one for new vinyl?
I went demo a Music Hall 2.1 today and the service at this "high end" store was lacking.
They didn't have a 5.1 in stock and seemed hesitant to order one.

M

[Paul Joppa]

Yeah, my last experience at a "high end" store was pretty off-putting. When you walk in, they hope you are gonna drop $15K for some speaker cables, and when you don't they are hoping the next guy will so they really just want to get rid of you.  :^)

Wow, I hope nobody here is offended - I had a bad experience, not a statistically meaningful batch of them. Nevertheless, I started designing for Bottlehead shortly after that...

[Grainger49]

I have bookmarked these places you might look for the Music Hall:

Acoustic Sounds

Elusive Disc

Music Direct

Needle Doctor

No affiliation, just a customer for LPs.  I don't know if they all stock Music Hall.

[Mudhiker]

Yeah, my last experience at a "high end" store was pretty off-putting. When you walk in, they hope you are gonna drop $15K for some speaker cables, and when you don't they are hoping the next guy will so they really just want to get rid of you.  :^)

Wow, I hope nobody here is offended - I had a bad experience, not a statistically meaningful batch of them. Nevertheless, I started designing for Bottlehead shortly after that...

Yeah, when I visited a "high end" music store, they turned each more expensive amp up louder to make it seem better than the previous.  So the $2000 integrated they kept at a moderate whisper, the $20k home theatre bumped a bit, and the $100k monstrosity shook the foundations.  Silly.

[Grainger49]

  .  .  .    they turned each more expensive amp up louder to make it seem better than the previous.  So the $2000 integrated they kept at a moderate whisper, the $20k home theatre bumped a bit, and the $100k monstrosity shook the foundations.  Silly.

Dear God, we are back in the 70s again.  (that is when I was selling high end)

[sl-15]

For equipment I had really good experience with the Needle Doctor.
For vinyl depending what you are looking for I would check forcedexposure.com and see if they have anything you are interested in. The other place is discogs.com. It is a user build discography database with a marketplace attached. There are lots of people who sell used stuff but I noticed more and more users who sell new vinyl there as well.

[xaudiomanx]

Paul,

Could you email me at my email address. [email protected]

Thanks!
Paul

[Grainger49]

You can contact Paul through his email on his profile.