Headphones

[TexasRugger]

Howdy.  I'm anxiously awaiting my Crack amp in the mail.  This will be my first DIY amp and I'm really looking forward to it.  My question revolves around headphones - I don't have any!   I'm looking to buy some that will work well with the Crack, which I believe means they need to be high impedance.  I've found that really limits my options to basically the Sennheisers or something like the AKGs.   I wasn't too impressed with the Sennheiser's I heard - too relaxed and un-dynamic.  Now that could have been the set-up I heard them on (no Bottlehead stuff!).   I'm looking to spend $200 to $300 and want something that can handle bass and dynamics really well.   Supposedly the Beyerdynamics don't handle bass particularly well.   Any thoughts, insights, suggestions for this headphone newbie?

Steve

[Natural Sound]

Howdy.  I'm anxiously awaiting my Crack amp in the mail.  This will be my first DIY amp and I'm really looking forward to it.  My question revolves around headphones - I don't have any!   I'm looking to buy some that will work well with the Crack, which I believe means they need to be high impedance.  I've found that really limits my options to basically the Sennheisers or something like the AKGs.   I wasn't too impressed with the Sennheiser's I heard - too relaxed and un-dynamic.  Now that could have been the set-up I heard them on (no Bottlehead stuff!).   I'm looking to spend $200 to $300 and want something that can handle bass and dynamics really well.   Supposedly the Beyerdynamics don't handle bass particularly well.   Any thoughts, insights, suggestions for this headphone newbie?

Steve

Headphone choice is a personal thing. Do you have a high end shop near you where you can try different headphones? If so, build the "crack" first and take it with you to the store with a few CD's that you are familiar and camp out for a while.

I have a pair of Sennheiser HD600's that I love to use with my S.E.X. amp. A "crack" amp is on my list of things to buy when funds become available. I think the folks at Bottlehead are very smart to offer low cost kits like "quickie" and "crack" during poor economic times. Very smart indeed. 

[Paul Birkeland]

There is one specific set of Beyerdynamics that might handle your bass desires...

http://www.performanceaudio.com/cgi/product_view.cgi?products_id=18457

[tdogzthmn]

Hello, I am wondering if the crack will work well with the AKG K240M which has an impedance of 600 ohms.  I know the crack was designed with the 300 ohm sennheisers in mind, but I hope it will mesh well with 250 and 600 ohm headphones.

[Doc B.]

Actually the Crack is designed specifically to work with high any impedance headphones, not just Sennheisers. Should work great with 600 ohm AKG 240s.

[ironbut]

I think the impressions you may have read about the Beyers were probably regarding the DT880's. They are very nice but, as you said, particularly bass shy. That said, the DT990's are similar to the 880's but with more bass. I have a pair of both and I can say that the Crack brings out much more bass in both Beyers than I'm used to hearing with them. Personally, with the Crack, I think the 990's have too much bass (I actually keep these cans for late night home theater sessions).
The Senn. 600/650 are a little laid back but the right amp can make a huge difference. Unfortunately, I sold my 600's not too long ago. The 650's have more bass than the 600's and there's lots of fans of the 580 too (I've never owned them so I won't comment).
I think that many of the AKG's will work with the Crack with the exception of the 701/2 or 340 electrostatic/dynamic hybrid. One of my favorite cans for classical is the K501. They too are a little bass shy but they might shine on this amp.
As you can see, there's a ton of choices (and I haven't even mentioned Ultrasones, Sonys, or Audio Technicas). But, that's one of the cool things about headphones. You can try a pair for a little while and resell them without much of a loss. If I'm curious about a particular model, I check out the Headfi "for sale" forum and buy them used. I've never gotten a bad pair that way. If they aren't my cup of tea, I put them up for sale again and just loose out on the shipping.
Also, Headfi has local meets all over the world. This will give you the opportunity to spend some time with some phones on other folk's systems.
In fact, if you're in the Chicago area, the International Meet is going to be there the first weekend of June.

All in all though, unless there's a meet in your neck of the woods in the next week or two, if I was in your shoes, I'd just buy a used pair and live with it for a little while.

[Jim R.]

Has anybody heard the Beyer 770s mentioned earlier?  How would they compare to the hd650s?  I'm looking for a reasonably priced set of closed cans for the bedroom, where the Crack will reside and the higher up Beyer models all seem to be open or semi-open.

Thanks,

Jim

[tdogzthmn]

I used to own the DT770 pro.  It was probably underamped but it had a very sharp treble which I did not like.  On the other hand I really liked the DT150 which is also closed.  It had a warmer sound and was much smoother sounding. 

[Dr. Toobz]

I'm currently using Beyers (DT880) with the Crack. I previously thought them to be a bit "bass shy" as well, but they have a ton of tight, punchy bass with the Crack (esp. with a Russian 6AS7G equivalent). They also sound great on the enhanced S.E.X., albeit with a bit less bass. When the bass is missing with these cans, you start to get the impression that they are overly bright and have a midrange hole - so a balanced amp that can deliver a ton of juice is key. I personally think the 990's are a bit too bassy and dark in comparison, and have never liked closed phones like the 770's. 

I also hear that the 600 ohm variant of the 880's are best, though I doubt that's been looked at objectively! I've not tried the higher impedance version myself.

I still wonder if the Crack would have an okay time with the AKG 701/702. They look marginal on paper, but there's no way of really knowing until somebody volunteers to plug theirs in....

[tdogzthmn]

Yes, I just sold my K702 because I wanted a headphone that would be more compatible with tube amps.  If it turns out the K702 plays well with the crack I would definitely get them again.

[Jim R.]

Thanks for the input guys.  I still like my 650s, just wish they were a bit more transparent and balanced overall, and maybe what I really want is the 600s.  Of course that does nothing for the closed can requirement, but maybe there's another way around that.

Thanks also for the characterization of the 770s -- those would probably give me a severe headache as I'm super sensitive to harsh treble.

Probably best to just build the amp and see what happens

-- Jim

[levlhed]

I just placed my order today.  Having never built a kit or even used headphones much this is a bit of an undertaking!
(I know I have some time before I even get the kit yet...)

I too am considering headphones.  I have a pair of Senneiser something or others I use for DJ monitoring.  I got them under the recommendations of some other DJ friends of mine when I complained about how every set I get fall apart.  These are built very well and have stood the careless DJ road test for over a year now.  Pure sound quality isn't really a consideration, just need to be loud enough and provide enough isolation for cue mix.
Anyway, just saying my experience w/ Sennheiser has been positive but not for the reasons I need a new set of headphones for.

I'm curious to hear about other peoples experiences with the usual suspects...
I'm leaning towards either HD600/650 or DT990 -600ohm version.

[Paul Birkeland]

A used pair of HD-600's for around $200 is pretty hard to beat!  The DT-990 is also a nice choice, but very difficult to find used. The two cans have a very different sound, so it might be best to look locally to try them both. What kind of music will you be listening to primarily?

[levlhed]

the DT990's can currently be had for $230 delivered!

I listen to electronic music almost exclusively.  Techno, Drum n Bass, Dubstep, Breakbeat, IDM and the likes.
Very very little guitar-based music.  Mostly 320 mp3/FLAC, for the headphone rig they will be served up by a netbook with the on-board audio until I can pick up a proper USB DAC.

Clean defined bass and smoothness/detail/liquid across the rest, please.  I like bass, but my tube/speaker rig in the home theater has shown me the pleasures of midrange detail as well...

 

[Paul Birkeland]

Hmm, I think this will really boil down to how you like your treble served up.  The HD-600 will be a little more laid back, although the 600 ohm Beyer cans are known for being less bright than their 250 ohm siblings.  For $230 new, I'd probably go for it.  (Care to share the source?  Best I can find is ~$230).