Tube Rolling w/Crack

[Joe Garfield]

Hahah

I definitely notice a difference with different 6080s in stock Crack. I’m just wondering if it’s a waste to buy input tubes before installing speedball or not.

My kit came with a GE 6080. I got a Tung Sol 6080 and to my ears it does things differently. I enjoy it more for different styles of music. It seems like an input tube with a nice juicy midrange would pair well with it. But will that change if I install speedball?

[Crackling]

I have a GE 6080 and a Sylvania 6080 among a few others. But the Sylvania 6080 is SO much better to my ears. I also have a couple of Tung-Sol 5998 tubes both in great condition (tested very high when purchased not too long ago from reputable vendors) but as much as I hate to admit it, the Sylvania 6080 somehow sounds different (in a good way) to me making me go back to it more often than not. It could also be what I'm pairing mine with too of course. Not too sure. Perhaps I need to do some A/B blind testing to see if I still prefer the Sylvania 6080. Maybe because I expect the Tung-Sol to sound so much better (because it cost so dang much more), I am a little bit disappointed?! Sorry, that's the psychologist in me talking... But the difference I feel between the GE and Sylvania is beyond just a feeling. The Sylvania 6080 has much less distortion especially in lower frequencies. The bass is noticeably cleaner when using Sylvania. Anyone else experienced this?

[Doc B.]

Don't overthink this. If you have a tube you like, use it. Use it up.

[Joe Garfield]

@crackling is it a GB6080 (Gold Brand)? I’ve read a few people mention liking the Sylvania GB6080 more than the 5998 and 421A. But even if it’s not, we all have different ears and brains so use what you like. People seem to really like the RCA clear top but I much prefer the Sylvania 12AU7 that BH provided in my kit.

[monsterdonkey]

Can anyone identify this 12AU7?

[Paul Birkeland]

RCA.

[jivex5k]

Well, after a few days listening during work I'm really starting to enjoy the crack's sound. I do have a bit of noise from my PC, but I ordered some rectifiers to implement the fix near the bus wire mentioned in the other post.

In the meantime I've been reading this massive thread, trying to slowly understand what tubes I can try out. I've narrowed down my selection to start with some cheaper ones, I'd just like to know if they will work with the crack.

https://tubedepot.com/products/telefunken-black-diamond-ecc82-12au7
https://tubedepot.com/products/mullard-12au7-ecc82-new-production-preamp-vacuum-tube

I'm guessing they are fine since they are 12au7?
Is there a way to be certain, when given the specs of a tube, that it won't break the amp? I don't know much about electrical flow or circuit design, but I'm trying to learn.

I'm also open for any cheaper recommendations to just try for fun. I'll be installing the speedball upgrade eventually and was reading it can reduce the distortion on the low end, which some people like. I saw a mullard tube mentioned as a possible way to get some back so I figured I'd get a new production mullard tube to see how it sounds.

Telefunken I picked because the name sounds cool.

[Paul Birkeland]

I wouldn't recommend spending that kind of money on new production tubes.

Her are two real Telefunken 12AU7s for $20
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Matched-Pair-Telefunken-ECC82-12AU7-Smooth-Plate-Diamond-TEST-NOS-Strong/133501912709?hash=item1f15558685:g:QycAAOSwbp9fRCfq

You should be able to find similar old stock Mullards for not much money. 

New Telefunken tubes are relabeled JJ tubes.  New Mullard tubes are relabeled Electro-Harmonix tubes.  There's nothing wrong with either, but they are only similar to the originals in name.

[monsterdonkey]

I wanted to have a few backup 12AU7 varieties around and I thought I’d try a new production tube  to see what the difference might be for myself. It’s a Northern Electric 12AU7. The music sounds good but there is a faint hiss that my RCA clear top doesn’t make. I don’t know if a few hours of burn will make it settle down. For now it’s a $40 experiment that I probably won’t repeat. Also in my bag of tubes were the orange painted RCA above, a GE JH 5814 and an RCA black plate 5963, which all together cost less than the NE. 

[tvr2500m]

I've lived with much tubed gear glowing with many tube types and hundreds of variants of these. I've come to a few things. You will never know how a tube sounds until you live with it and gain experience with it with your ears in your gear. Tube cost and sonic performance aren't necessarily positively correlated. Often that flea-market-priced humble-brand tube sounds better than that expensive NOS uber brand/reputation tube. And that there is no one magic tube that is perfect. Tubes can alter the sonics of piece substantially, but typically there are favorites, and several of them. (Also, learn to positively identify a tube by what's in the bottle, less than the ink on the outside; this way you are certain of exactly what you have and what you might want to talk about/share with others)

I have a very (very) large selection of 12AU7 family tubes. Because of the Crack, I now have a very nice selection of 6080/6AS7Gs. And I have a good handle of which flavors of these tubes I prefer in the Crack. I feel the Crack always sounds great, and a few favorite tubes take the sonic fun even further for me. I've only used Drop Sennheiser 6XX and 58X with the Crack, for reference. (I am curious what some other high impedance headphone brands and models might sound like with the Crack, but haven't gotten there, yet)

What I'm asking this group about are some "odd", "rare", oft-very-pricey 12AU7 types that I'm seeing more of more recently. I don't have any of these. I'm wondering whether people here may have some experience with them that they'd like to share.

Among these are:

- Italian Fivre brand
- Any OSRAM or GEC
- Telefunken G73-R

And, how are some of the more current production premium 12AU7s:

- Psvanes
- TJ Full Music



Love to hear what experience people have had with these tubes.

[jivex5k]

I wouldn't recommend spending that kind of money on new production tubes.

Her are two real Telefunken 12AU7s for $20
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Matched-Pair-Telefunken-ECC82-12AU7-Smooth-Plate-Diamond-TEST-NOS-Strong/133501912709?hash=item1f15558685:g:QycAAOSwbp9fRCfq

You should be able to find similar old stock Mullards for not much money. 

New Telefunken tubes are relabeled JJ tubes.  New Mullard tubes are relabeled Electro-Harmonix tubes.  There's nothing wrong with either, but they are only similar to the originals in name.

Ah thanks. I felt a twinge of excitement watching the ebay bidding on this tube, that could be trouble...

[attmci]

I've lived with much tubed gear glowing with many tube types and hundreds of variants of these. I've come to a few things. You will never know how a tube sounds until you live with it and gain experience with it with your ears in your gear. Tube cost and sonic performance aren't necessarily positively correlated. Often that flea-market-priced humble-brand tube sounds better than that expensive NOS uber brand/reputation tube. And that there is no one magic tube that is perfect. Tubes can alter the sonics of piece substantially, but typically there are favorites, and several of them. (Also, learn to positively identify a tube by what's in the bottle, less than the ink on the outside; this way you are certain of exactly what you have and what you might want to talk about/share with others)

I have a very (very) large selection of 12AU7 family tubes. Because of the Crack, I now have a very nice selection of 6080/6AS7Gs. And I have a good handle of which flavors of these tubes I prefer in the Crack. I feel the Crack always sounds great, and a few favorite tubes take the sonic fun even further for me. I've only used Drop Sennheiser 6XX and 58X with the Crack, for reference. (I am curious what some other high impedance headphone brands and models might sound like with the Crack, but haven't gotten there, yet)

What I'm asking this group about are some "odd", "rare", oft-very-pricey 12AU7 types that I'm seeing more of more recently. I don't have any of these. I'm wondering whether people here may have some experience with them that they'd like to share.

Among these are:

- Italian Fivre brand
- Any OSRAM or GEC
- Telefunken G73-R

And, how are some of the more current production premium 12AU7s:

- Psvanes
- TJ Full Music



Love to hear what experience people have had with these tubes.

Which 12AU7 you like the most?

Beware of fakes on the eastBay.

[greenneedle]

My favourite 12AU7 is the Mazda 12AU7.  Both the English and "Foreign" ones sound good to me paired with a Tung Sol 5998. 

Then a TungSol 12AU7 (old one not the new productions) and a Brimar CV4003/12AU7WA which run the Mazda close.

I have one of those Tunsgrams above and they are next in my line behind the 3 mentioned already.
 

[tintin]

Have been enjoying my Crack+Speedball immensely for the past week. Must say that at first I wasn't too big a fan of the speedball; I do enjoy very warm tubey sounds and I felt it took that away a bit from the stock Crack in exchange for better technicalities. I've had some fun tube rolling with a large amount of 6080 and 6AS7Gs from another amp and have been pleasantly surprised by how well the tubes which I had previously deemed too slow or muddy sounding are shining in the speedballed Crack. I have also noted that  tube rolling impacts sonic changes much less compared to the stock Crack (the 'premium' tubes e.g. GEC, Tung Sol did make a more noticeable impact on the sound).

Have only been able to pair with a Gold Lion ECC82 and the stock Baldwin 12au7 as of now, but have ordered some Mullards and 6SN7s to try. With the gold lion I have really enjoyed the Sylvania 'gold brand' 6080, Mullard CV2984, a pair of GEC CV4079+ adaptor (sound practically identical to the GEC 6AS7G for a fraction of the price) and to my surprise a random Chinese (Nanjing production) 6N13P tube I had lying around. I had a pair of them but the first one's guide pin broke as I plugged it in; it was hollow... Vacuum no more.  But it really gives a nice warm roundness. Will get around to trying the 5998 as I dig through my box; I have always preferred the British tubes to it though. Am excited to try the Mullard ECC82 with the more neutral output tubes for a touch more warmth.

[jivex5k]

Testing out a Sovtek 6AS7G right now, fixed the issue I was having with faint background noise.
I swear it sounds thinner than the 6080, not sure... could be in my head. Maybe it needs to burn in longer.

I'll have to do some comparisons for fun. This is pretty damn neat, really awesome kit. Thanks for the new hobby

EDIT-
Yep, it sounds better after listening for a while today... at least I think it does. It's more of a feeling than an objective assessment.