News: Trouble logging in? Log in from the login page.
August 18, 2019, 06:16:29 AM

Author Topic: The Climax speaker  (Read 25433 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Doc B.

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7785
    • Bottlehead
The Climax speaker
« on: October 15, 2009, 06:13:25 AM »
Here's a link to the PDF file of this design's discussion - a prototype product that won best sound of show, but was doomed when the midwoofer chosen for the design went out of production -

https://web.archive.org/web/20140209153406/http://www.bottlehead.com/climax/climax.pdf
« Last Edit: July 22, 2016, 10:09:36 AM by Doc B. »
Dan "Doc B." Schmalle
President For Life
Bottlehead Corp.

Offline d052057

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2009, 08:46:32 PM »
I Just spoke with eminence rep today regarding on LA6-MB.  They are thinking about making the spakers again but they don't know when.  They got call about the speaker often.

Offline BNAL

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 344
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2009, 02:50:50 AM »
What is the number. I will give them a call asking for a pair of the LA6-MB. Maybe if Eminence gets enough calls they will put the speakers back into production, or at least a limited run.
Brad Nalitt
Iron Upgraded S.E.X. Amp 2.0
Foreplay III
Quickie w/PJCCS
Eros Phono
Blumenstein Orca Speakers, Baby Benthic Subs
S.E.X.y Speakers W/FT17H Horn Tweeters
Thorens TD 125 MkII W/ Shure M97xE JICO SAS Stylus

Offline tbbenton

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 30
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #3 on: December 09, 2009, 03:46:28 AM »
What is the number. I will give them a call asking for a pair of the LA6-MB. Maybe if Eminence gets enough calls they will put the speakers back into production, or at least a limited run.

A while back(12/7/07) I requested a quote from Eminence for a minimal (100) custom production run of the speaker.  I never did see that quote.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2009, 03:49:24 AM by tbbenton »
Tom Benton

Offline Paul Joppa

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4854
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #4 on: December 09, 2009, 06:02:59 AM »
Eminence has usually been pretty open to small production runs (100 units minimum) of custom drivers. In the current economic climate they are probably even more open - assuming they still have the experienced staff necessary.

When the Climax project was dropped, I looked into all that, and tried to find if there was enough interest in the community to justify such an order. I also had in mind some improvements that might add a modest cost but improve performance, such as underhung voice coils and a shorting ring to reduce distortion. At that time it did not appear that we would sell more than 25 or 30 drivers.
Paul Joppa

Offline d052057

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2009, 12:47:38 PM »
The number I called is 502-845-5622 and I get transfered to a person (I forget the name).  I get the call back from the person.  Then number is 502-845-227.  I have spoken with him about 10 to 15 minutes about how hard to find the speakers.  The reason they discountinue it because they 'DON'T SELL'.  Since he got many call requesting the speakers, he is thinking about putting it back in the market again, he said.  However, he doesn't know 'WHEN'.  I have made suggested to him that he can run a small batch to meet the demand.

If the speakers are available, I am thinking doing the "Climax Avec 4 Bangers" instead of regular a Climax.  I am going to put 4 LA6-MBs and a tweeter in one enclosure.  However, I am sure it is worth or not by doing that way.  Paul may know this better since this is his design (and of course I don't any thing about the drivers and the xcross over).

or I am thinking about doing the 'Climax Avec 8 Bangers' aka 'Orgy Climax' by putting 8 LA6-MBs and a tweeter in one enclosure.
Xcross Over - Paul?
:)

Offline tbbenton

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 30
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2009, 02:16:43 PM »
Eminence has usually been pretty open to small production runs (100 units minimum) of custom drivers. In the current economic climate they are probably even more open

I noticed they dropped their minimum to 50 units now, and I bet they'd give you a quote.  I'm not personally interested now that I've built some econowaves and have parts for another pair.
Tom Benton

Offline Paul Joppa

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4854
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #7 on: December 09, 2009, 03:34:57 PM »
...
If the speakers are available, I am thinking doing the "Climax Avec 4 Bangers" instead of regular a Climax.  I am going to put 4 LA6-MBs and a tweeter in one enclosure.  However, I am sure it is worth or not by doing that way.  Paul may know this better since this is his design (and of course I don't any thing about the drivers and the xcross over).
...
Here's the first paragraph of the document:

"This design shares a couple of major features of the SEXy Speaker. Both are high-efficiency
small boxes with no deep bass, meant to be combined with a pair of commercial powered subwoofers for a complete full-range system. In this way, low-power SET amplifiers can be used in a system of modest size. Both are offered as designs for non-commercial DIY construction."

As you see, the LA6-MB was not used below about 125Hz. And there is a reason - its linear excursion is quite limited. Actually, in the first version we did run it in a larger ported box to provide bass to about 50Hz in theory. It never sounded like there was any deep bass though, and it would break up on loud bass passages - a clear sign that this driver is not suited for the deep bass.

If anyone does not want to use a powered subwoofer, it would be perfectly practical to use a woofer, or an array of several woofers, with a passive or active crossover between them. An array of four more conventional 6" or 8" woofers running 88-89dB individually would provide enough efficiency to take care of the baffle step effect, and such woofers could easily have the larger excursion and softer suspension necessary for decent bass. In fact, this could make a miniature version of the big system now running in DocB's listening room.

As far as I know no one has done this, but another use of this driver is as a side or back speaker in a multi-way home theater. These auxiliary speakers deliver most of their effect even if they have no high treble or deep bass, and the LA6-MB in the Climax box would deliver 125Hz to 5kHz quite well - no tweeter, no crossover, just a speaker in a box. That bandwidth is very well balanced, neither shrill nor boomy. Ought to work fine with iPods and table radios as well - anywhere a cheap, decent general purpose speaker is OK.
Paul Joppa

Offline Tim G.

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 41
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2010, 06:53:05 AM »
I'm getting ready to install the Selenium tweeter in my straight 8's and was going to play around the mods described in the Climax pdf.  I'm looking for any advice on the bullnose molding mod.   Does anyone have an pictures of how they install that?  The front bezel is raised and I'm curious how to get it to mount flush..

Thanks in advance..

Tim

Offline Doc B.

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7785
    • Bottlehead
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #9 on: July 11, 2010, 07:40:32 AM »
You don't need to worry about flush mounting. Just use 1/2" quarter round on each side of the slot and then put 1/2" felt over the whole upper front baffle, clear out to the edges. That will sit flush with the quarter round and the raised flange parts will not be that noticeable under the felt. PJ showed strips of felt in his drawing because we were considering materials cost if we did this as a kit. But for a little more money you can buy 12" squares of felt from Mcmaster Carr and use one piece of felt with a hole cut in it for the slot and quarter round.
Dan "Doc B." Schmalle
President For Life
Bottlehead Corp.

Offline Tim G.

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 41
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2010, 03:13:00 AM »
That makes perfect sense now, thanks for the quick reply.  I will post my results with the different mods and how this goes with the ol' reliable S8.

Thanks

Tim

Offline d052057

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2010, 10:52:42 AM »
My recent activity related to my Climax speakers.
I recently get a pair of A4 Advent speakers from GoodWill.  After I refoamed the woofer and listened to them for a while, I can't figure out why they donate these to GoodWill.  They are very musical.  My first impression is WOW and WOW.  Then I get into listening session comparing Climax and the Advent A4 speakers.
There pros and cons on both side.  Climax is lacking of bass and the Adv A4 does. The Adv A4 is lacking of details just a little bit behind the Climax etc..
I have gotten suggestions from asylum users to double the Adv A4 (2 Adv A4s on one side) if I want to mod them.  Then my conclusion from this is that I will put Climax on the top of the Adv A4 speaker instead.

The sound is so so much better with this combination.   This will bring the CLIMAX to another level.  I am very very happy and sastified with this configuration.  I recommend this is a much if you do have the ADV A4 speakers.

I used to have the Climax in my bedroom.  Now I can have 'Climax' with Adv A4 in a different room.  I called this 'Advent Climax'.  Let's fun begin (and my wife likes it thought).

My gears: Onkyo M-506 RS (Reference Signature), Samsung Universal player (DVD818 or something (can't remember)) with heavily mods, Foreplay II with all mods.

Offline Grainger49

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7175
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2010, 11:50:04 AM »
I worked at the shop in Atlanta where "The Double Advent System" was first demonstrated back in the 70s so I am very familiar with this set up.  The double Advents, of any sort, can place a hard impedance on the amplifier driving it.  The Climax is intended for SET amplifiers and has a much "gentler" impedance curve.  The Onkyo seems to be a SS power house.  I would expect in the comparison that the Advent speakers would lack "finesse."

Offline Paul Joppa

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4854
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2010, 02:41:41 PM »
Just a quick note, since Grainger's post gives me an excuse to do a bit of myth-busting.

The Climax actually has a wild impedance curve. with a very high impedance around the crossover frequency and above. The thing is, it was designed around an SET amp with damping factor of 2 to 3. It will sound a little recessed with a high-damping solid state amp. The impedance does not drop much below the nominal - that is always going to be a difficult load for an SET - but high impedances are not a problem by themselves.
Paul Joppa

Offline Doc B.

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7785
    • Bottlehead
Re: The Climax speaker
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2010, 05:02:57 PM »
Quote
Climax is lacking of bass

Just to clarify, do you mean that the tweeter/midrange combination is lacking bass? No argument there. The Climax "system" was of course designed to be the Climax cabinets in combination with subwoofers below 100Hz since the tweeter/midwoofer combo rolls off at 12dB/octave at that point. 
Dan "Doc B." Schmalle
President For Life
Bottlehead Corp.