Tube Rolling w/Crack

[Doc B.]

I think our design philosophy has probably not been discussed as much as it should lately. Basically, we feel that the sonic impact of the circuit design itself outweighs all of the parts swapping. So the tube rolling and cap swapping that seems to positively consume some builders, while it does certainly have a sonic impact, is just the final tuning step and not a thing that "fixes" a problem. Changing a tube is more like your short brunette girlfriend changed her hairstyle than like you got a new tall blonde one. Some of us wouldn't even notice if Norah Jones got a haircut, but no one is gonna miss the difference between Norah Jones and Charlize Theron.

Everyone should pursue a hobby in such a manner that it gives them maximum satisfaction. I imagine that if some tube and cap rollers spent an equal amount of energy learning as much as possible about how the circuits that they are rolling parts thru work they would find the hobby even more rewarding.

[adamct]

I think our design philosophy has probably not been discussed as much as it should lately. Basically, we feel that the sonic impact of the circuit design itself outweighs all of the parts swapping. So the tube rolling and cap swapping that seems to positively consume some builders, while it does certainly have a sonic impact, is just the final tuning step and not a thing that "fixes" a problem. Changing a tube is more like your short brunette girlfriend changed her hairstyle than like you got a new tall blonde one. Some of us wouldn't even notice if Norah Jones got a haircut, but no one is gonna miss the difference between Norah Jones and Charlize Theron.

Everyone should pursue a hobby in such a manner that it gives them maximum satisfaction. I imagine that if some tube and cap rollers spent an equal amount of energy learning as much as possible about how the circuits that they are rolling parts thru work they would find the hobby even more rewarding.

I am, admittedly, a frequent offender. That said, this should be added as a sticky in every product forum.

[earwaxxer]

There ideally should be some sort of 'zen' about the whole process. That, of course, is ideal in most, if not all, situations in life, depending one ones philosophy etc. Doc makes some good points. Mindless lust for "better" sound is a "fools errand"... (god I love that pirate shit!) - but what CAN be a positive is getting to know these various parts, relative to how they sound in kit "A" vs speaker crossover "B", vs. whatever. Parts definitely make a "difference". Rolling tubes makes a difference. Its all part of the game. We only have so many years on this earth. Thats why people spend thousands of buccaneers on caps/tubes/yourcurrentobsession

[Mike B]

I always roll.  With Bottlehead gear I roll before the stuff even gets here.  Lead time ya know.

I like it, I call it the "research" period.

For Crack, I have a couple of Solen 100 uf poly films 'cause everyone knows that anything is better than electrolytic for coupling caps.

And I got some Sylvania triple mica 6080's and some RCA side getter clear tops.

Why?  Cause Doc said that was what he was going to put in with the first 6 "special deal" orders and I knew I was not in the "6"

Yeah, you talk about how good stock is, but then you ply us with "special" tube offers.

The only valve gear I have that I never rolled tubes in is the K12G kit that started me down this glass path.  It still has the original 10GV8's in it.

[John EH]

I have built two of these Crack's with Speedball now.  Both amps SHINE with Mullard Box Plate CV4003's.  Best tube in my amps far and above anything else and I have them all I think.

John

[Mike B]

I bought one on your rec.

I'm done.  I am getting close to the line.

Never spend more on accessories than you spent on the item to be accessorized.

[w0lfd0g]

Never spend more on accessories than you spent on the item to be accessorized.

Spend to whatever level you like, provided:

1. It is within your means
2. It brings you enjoyment

The line is different for everyone, gentlemen. 

[Mike B]

Oh, I don't care what anybody else spends, just me.

I figure if I spent more on accessories that I did on the original item, I would have been better off just buying something better in the first place.

[w0lfd0g]

That sounds logical to me!   

I'm just very happy with the amp I have and its fit with the rest of my system.  I don't mind spending a bit more on optimising it!

[earwaxxer]

I think Nathan has expressed a "truism"  that hits us modders in the gut. We are much more inclined to experiment with kit that was affordable to obtain. I felt that way with the Quickie and my Maggie MMG's. I just went crazy on them. Why not? A great experience that I would have never had with high priced kit. IMO.....

[palmfish]

I got home from a business trip today and my new tubes were waiting for me! CBS 6AS7G and CBS 5814A. I can't tell any difference in sound quality from the stock tubes, but microphonics are much improved. And they look so good!

(https://www.head-fi.org/image/id/4930890/width/900/height/900/flags/LL)

[Pepper]

I ordered a Tung Sol 5998 tube, and so I'm hoping to try that out soon. I hear there is a very noticeable improvement, especially because it is a different design (or something?).

However, I am wondering if replacing the small tube makes a big difference. If so, what type of tubes could I be looking at if I'm going to be working with a Tung Sol 5998 for the big tube?

Thanks!

[adamct]

Read through the last couple of pages in this thread. As far as I'm concerned, the benefits of rolling either tube are quite limited, particularly if you have installed the Speedball. And if you haven't installed the Speedball, then you are far better off installing the Speedball than spending money on tubes. None of the tubes I have tried has been a reliable, significant and cost-effective improvement over the stock tubes, which could very well wind up being less microphonic and noisy than whatever you replace them with, regardless of cost. And note that I say that without evening knowing what stock tubes you received. Why? Because it ultimately doesn't matter what you got with your kit.

Still, some people enjoy rolling tubes, so you won't get any arguments here if you decide to try for yourself. But if you are on the fence and money is tight, you can be secure that you aren't missing out on anything at all. And if you do decide to roll tubes, don't set your expectations too high, or you are likely to be disappointed.

Best regards,
Adam

[w0lfd0g]

Read through the last couple of pages in this thread. As far as I'm concerned, the benefits of rolling either tube are quite limited, particularly if you have installed the Speedball. And if you haven't installed the Speedball, then you are far better off installing the Speedball than spending money on tubes. None of the tubes I have tried has been a reliable, significant and cost-effective improvement over the stock tubes, which could very well wind up being less microphonic and noisy than whatever you replace them with, regardless of cost. And note that I say that without evening knowing what stock tubes you received. Why? Because it ultimately doesn't matter what you got with your kit.

Still, some people enjoy rolling tubes, so you won't get any arguments here if you decide to try for yourself. But if you are on the fence and money is tight, you can be secure that you aren't missing out on anything at all. And if you do decide to roll tubes, don't set your expectations too high, or you are likely to be disappointed.

Best regards,
Adam

+1

[Pepper]

Hey guys,

I've done some research, and there's glowing praise for the 12BH7A as a replacement for the 12AU7 in the Bottlehead Crack. I read one post which said there had to be a circuit modification.

Can anyone confirm if the 12BH7A needs any sort of circuit modification to work in the Bottlehead Crack + Speedball upgrade?

Also, having a 12BH7A and a Tung Sol 5998 would work, right? Or is there some circuitry/electronics reason why the two might not work together?

Thank you so much.